Click to view our Accessibility Statement or contact us with accessibility-related questions
GoAndDo
49
Mar 2, 2018
I take it this one is $35 more than the last drop because the steel is better? I want to get a Recon 1, but budget being what it is I was looking for it to go down in price, not up :)
GoAndDoIn all fairness CPM-S35VN is a fantastic blade steel. Much better than the usual cheap-o budget steel they use. If it weren't for the Tac-Black blade coating I might consider picking it up.
Unwisefool
480
Mar 2, 2018
MaxwellDemonicThe usual steel is cts-xhp, not a cheap steel
Unwisefool"CTS-XHP, is a powder metallurgy, air-hardening, high carbon, high chromium, corrosion-resistant alloy. It can be considered either a high hardness 440C stainless steel or a corrosion-resistant D2 tool steel." As per Wikipedia.
Being a powdered alloy steel doesn't automatically make it good, especially not compared to the majority of CPM steels. And even if we disagree, verifiable fact, CTS-XHP is cheaper to purchase than CPM-S35VN.
Unwisefool
480
Mar 3, 2018
MaxwellDemonicBut it's not a budget steel as you claimed.
Unwisefool440 variants are budget steel.
https://www.massdrop.com/buy/cold-steel-pro-lite-folding-knives Recent drop, in 4116, which is a budget steel.
I'm not saying all of them are, but the majority of drops from Cold Steel are in lower quality, price conscious steels.
EDIT: Alright, so maybe I was rash to say it was budget steel, but if you look at my further comments I wasn't originally saying "Cold Steel uses XHP which is budget", it was "Cold Steels drops on Massdrop typically use budget steels."
Unwisefool
480
Mar 3, 2018
MaxwellDemonicOk not talking about 4116. But keep on thinking that it's no good.
UnwisefoolWhen did I ever say "budget steels are no good". They have their market, and I find that Cold Steel typically tries to sell their products at a higher price point than the materials would dictate. This however seems like a decent offering.
Vgex
29
Mar 4, 2018
MaxwellDemonicHave you ever used CTS-XHP? It’s one of the best kept secrets out there. You should probably look up some testing on it, before you consider it inferior, lol. To me S35VN, is a downgrade.
Vgex
29
Mar 4, 2018
MaxwellDemonicWell, was a secret. Now the secrets out, costs have skyrocketed, and Cold Steel has to move on to other steels to keep the costs down.
Warkaven
62
Mar 4, 2018
GoAndDoCTS XHP is better than S35vn
Warkaven
62
Mar 4, 2018
MaxwellDemonic'cheap-o budget steel'? 'Tac-Black blade coating'? What are you still from 2007? Or are you willfully trolling? CS has been using CTS XHP for 3 years now, and their DLC coating is probably the best in the industry, without charging you extra for it like Spyderco does.
Warkaven
62
Mar 4, 2018
MaxwellDemonicMaxwellDemonic, either you're a completely dense fool, or are just subversively trolling. Everything you've said is a joke. There's no point in discussing with you any further.
Unwisefool
480
Mar 4, 2018
VgexI have a Hinderer XM18 in CTS-XHP, it would not have been used if it wasn't a high quality steel
WarkavenCould always put up a community poll and see who else agrees.
WarkavenMaybe I'm wrong about the qualities of CTS XHP. Looking over the summary components of each steel, XHP is missing out on Niobium, which is typically associated to edge retention and wear resistance.
I will always think that DLC coatings are ugly, then again I don't get a ton of hard use out of my knives and I'm sure in places where they can't properly be maintained and stored, it would come in handy.
Additionally as a final point, I don't follow Cold Steel closely as they do not produce products I'm typically interested in. The majority of Drops I've seen come through the site don't use XHP (such as the other active Cold Steel drop in 4116). This isn't an indictment of the company as a whole, just what I typically see through MD.
sheffieldsg
72
Mar 7, 2018
MaxwellDemonicI have many knives in cts xhp and s35vn and I've used them both quite a bit and the cts xhp has outperformed s35vn every time. The only advantage of s35vn is that it's more corrosion resistant. Xhp definitely holds an edge longer and will take a keener edge. Just because xhp is in the "440c family" doesn't mean it performs like 440c. I hate 440c and avoid it but I can't get enough of xhp. I've found that it performs very near the level of m4. Before I bought my first knife in xhp I thought it was just a stainless d2 like you're saying but it's performance completely changed any assumptions I had made prior. As a result I now own 11 knives in xhp. I've found that xhp will give "higher end" steels a run for their money until you get to the m390, 20cv, 204p steels. Yes, s35vn is more expensive which adds to the incredible value of xhp. As far as cold steel goes the heat treat on their knives is phenomenal. Aside from the Recon 1 Massdrop has mostly offered their budget knives like the taclite that's designed to compete with the 8cr13mov type of knives from Kershaw etc. Massdrop rarely features production knives at a lower price than other retailers so using what's featured here as a representation of what's good is inaccurate.
sheffieldsgI'm always a little leery of metallurgical blends that I can't find formulations for online. The exact proportions of specific elements in s35vn are available a handful of places. The best I've been able to get for XHP is a list of elements without specific weights. Normally you can compare those lists and get a rough idea of how each stacks up in terms of wear resistant, corrosion resistant, etc. In this case XHP has more anecdotal evidence than anything else. I will have to challenge you on that last line. I have 3 Kizers on my desk that disagree with your statement (all of which were $30 cheaper than production, and in one case $150 cheaper). I don't know why their offerings from Cold Steel are typically budget conscious, and I admitted earlier I'm not super familiar with Cold Steel's catalog at large. They lost me with most of their absurd cutting demos.
I appreciate the thoughtful and well composed response by the way.
sheffieldsg
72
Mar 7, 2018
MaxwellDemonicGood call on the Kizers. I should have clarified that production knives from American companies don't tend to be any less expensive on Massdrop from what I've seen ie cold steel, Spyderco.
sheffieldsgAbsolutely fair point. The Chinese companies usually offer decent discounts but most US based companies are seldom to offer good deals though MD.
sheffieldsg
72
Mar 7, 2018
MaxwellDemonicIf you're not already familiar with Cedric & Ada Gear and Outdoors on YouTube you should check out his channel. He primarily does cutting tests with different steels. They're obviously not scientific but are very interesting to see. I think you'd enjoy it.
sheffieldsgI'll give it a look. Most times I watch Nick Shabazz and Birdshot IV for knife reviews, The latter being less informative than the former.
sheffieldsg
72
Mar 7, 2018
MaxwellDemonicShabazz and Bird are great. Doctor frunkey and epic snuggle bunny are decent as well. Cedric is good because he actually cuts and tests different steels.
sheffieldsg
72
Mar 9, 2018
MaxwellDemonicThere's an app that has a huge database of steels and their composition. You can even compare different steels on a graph. It's called: knife steel composition chart. I highly recommend it and it has xhp.
sheffieldsgOooh, awesome. Sounds like a useful tool since we see a wide variety of steels on MD.