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Q-Prof
11
Jul 27, 2017
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Petronas44
236
Jul 27, 2017
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Q-ProfI'm going to give you a little advice and then if you have more specific questions afterwards I'll try to help, after owning more than 30 pairs of headphones along with different amps and dacs my opinion is nobody can really tell you what you will like or what is worth it to you. There is alot of room for improvement over your pc37x, especially with a $700 budget so my advice would be to spend more on a quality set of headphones to start out with and then decide what you need next (dac or amp) and really do a ton of research before you buy anything. Suggestions:
Headphones- gaming/movies
1. Sony mdrz-7 my favorite for this category and in your price range could be had used on eBay for less than $300 and also available new on eBay $435 and up
2. Fostex thx00- plenty of info on it here
3. Audio technica ath ad 900x/1000x/2000x- I think the sweet spot here is the 1000x for around $280 and this really falls more into the music/gaming but an amp with a bass boost is really needed to make it good for gaming and movies. Excellent for music
There are more lmk what you think
Picking headphones out for music is alot more tough it really depends on your preferences in sound and music, the hd6xx, I owned the hd650 and still yet to find a headphone that does what that headphone did so well but there are others that you may easily prefer over them so I'd feel more comfortable suggesting some stuff for music or an all rounder if I knew more about your priorities and preferences
Q-Prof
11
Jul 28, 2017
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Petronas44Appreciate your input, I was going to just use the PC37X for everything, but now all the hype that I have seen on both the Fostex and HD6XX being soooo good, I was thinking of getting another pair of phones just for movies and maybe some music as the PC37X have that sweet mic built-in that is reviewed as being pretty good and would keep for just gaming (I know I can buy also a really great phone and attach a mic later, just personal preference of liking it all built-in together). You mentioned that a there is in-fact a lot of room for improvement, which I will take your's and others in these comments.
Reading reviews on your suggestions you made, people are really happy with them. I checked on Amazon Canada and see the Sony's for almost 900 here, and the ATH 1000X going for 480, and of course the Fostex going for 500 American here. My budget was considering the amp and dac as a necessity (thinking of the HD6XX initially), as I kept reading that you absolutely need those both in most cases to really get the sound quality out of the phones. For example, for the HD6XX some recommend the Jotunheimwith the Modi Multibit or Modi 2 Multibit with the Valhalla 2.... the point I am trying to make is - to budget in the DAC/AMP right away to get the best sound performance out of them right away. If I purchase a phone 700, then sink in for DAC/AMP to get that phone to it's optimum output listening quality I will feel obligated to still get the DAC/AMP which will put me past the 700 budget.
Reading reviews on your suggestions you made, people are really happy with them. I checked on Amazon Canada and see the Sony's for almost 900 here, and the ATH 1000X going for 480, and of course the Fostex going for 500 American here. My budget was considering the amp and dac as a necessity (thinking of the HD6XX initially), as I kept reading that you absolutely need those both in most cases to really get the sound quality out of the phones. For example, for the HD6XX some recommend the Jotunheimwith the Modi Multibit or Modi 2 Multibit with the Valhalla 2.... the point I am trying to make is - to budget in the DAC/AMP right away to get the best sound performance out of them right away. If I purchase a phone 700, then sink in for DAC/AMP to get that phone to it's optimum output listening quality I will feel obligated to still get the DAC/AMP which will put me past the 700 budget.
amoeba1126
460
Jul 28, 2017
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Q-ProfI haven't had a chance to listen to the PC37X yet, but going by reviews, specs, and dissembled pics, it looks like the headset is based off the Sennheiser HD598 with an attached mic. The HD598 is a very solid pair of entry tier headphones. Both the HD6XX and TH-X00 will be improvements IMO, but you may be disappointed over the amount of improvement. It is important to keep in mind that the higher up you go in headphones, the more marginal the difference.
HD598 VS HD6XX VS TH-X00 HD598 definitely has more treble presence than the HD6XX, but the HD6XX is overall more detailed (assuming both are properly amped) and just a better set of headphones. Both are amazingly comfortable to wear. The TH-X00 in comparison, has a noticeably more recessed midrange but significantly more mid-bass presence. Actual bass extension can be a wash depending given as there are times where the boosted mid-bass slam of the TH-X00 muddies up it's own bass.
HD6XX VS TH-X00 HD6XX are better headphones (one of the best) for songs with vocals. The TH-X00 are still good, but the HD650 is noticeably better. Both are lightweight, but the HD6XX wins out again here in terms of overall comfort. The HD6XX is open however and really do need a proper amp to break through the infamous veiled sound however. In this regards, the TH-X00 shoots up way ahead as it is able to be used in an office environment due to it's semi-closed nature and high efficiency (does not need an amp to still sound very good). That said, it's high efficiency and design does take a hit with Fostex's decision to make the cable non-detachable and super long. HD6XX are safe, laid back headphones that work well with all genres where as TH-X00 are fun and lively, therefore more polarizing.
Amps and Stuff While the TH-X00 do benefit from proper amping, it actually still does very well without it. The HD6XX on the other hand, sounds very muted without proper amping and pairs up very well with tube amps like Bottlehead Crack, Lyr/Vahalla, or Little Dot. The TH-X00 is much less picky about amps, though I tend to prefer pairing it up with warm amps to further smooth over the trebles.
HD598 VS HD6XX VS TH-X00 HD598 definitely has more treble presence than the HD6XX, but the HD6XX is overall more detailed (assuming both are properly amped) and just a better set of headphones. Both are amazingly comfortable to wear. The TH-X00 in comparison, has a noticeably more recessed midrange but significantly more mid-bass presence. Actual bass extension can be a wash depending given as there are times where the boosted mid-bass slam of the TH-X00 muddies up it's own bass.
HD6XX VS TH-X00 HD6XX are better headphones (one of the best) for songs with vocals. The TH-X00 are still good, but the HD650 is noticeably better. Both are lightweight, but the HD6XX wins out again here in terms of overall comfort. The HD6XX is open however and really do need a proper amp to break through the infamous veiled sound however. In this regards, the TH-X00 shoots up way ahead as it is able to be used in an office environment due to it's semi-closed nature and high efficiency (does not need an amp to still sound very good). That said, it's high efficiency and design does take a hit with Fostex's decision to make the cable non-detachable and super long. HD6XX are safe, laid back headphones that work well with all genres where as TH-X00 are fun and lively, therefore more polarizing.
Amps and Stuff While the TH-X00 do benefit from proper amping, it actually still does very well without it. The HD6XX on the other hand, sounds very muted without proper amping and pairs up very well with tube amps like Bottlehead Crack, Lyr/Vahalla, or Little Dot. The TH-X00 is much less picky about amps, though I tend to prefer pairing it up with warm amps to further smooth over the trebles.
Petronas44
236
Jul 28, 2017
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Q-ProfSorry to hear about pricing on those cans I've heard audio products are much more expensive there, so yea you really can't go wrong with the 6xx it's one of the greats for a reason and now at a great price. As far as amps go I like to steer anyone away from tubes until they have a really good solid state set-up I would suggest the jotenheim as well, it's the best amp I've ever heard and a steal at $400 but then you still need a dac and I'm sure the multibit is amazing but if you get the jot it's going to kill your budget, you could get the jotenheim with the built in dac it's a bi mono dac setup which means you will be balanced from the source to your headphones or powered monitors.
amoeba1126
460
Jul 28, 2017
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Petronas44I am definitely being a bit elitist here, but IMO solid state amps suck compared to proper tube amps. Tube rolling is also addictively fun.
Petronas44
236
Jul 28, 2017
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amoeba1126I'm happy to hear you are enjoying what you like that is what this is all about, find the perfect sound or sounds for yourself, everybody is different even if only a little in some cases and if your into this long enough your tastes and preferences change over time and you find new things that you enjoy. I think I would enjoy another tube amp again but only if I were spending allot of money the cheaper ones just weren't doing it for me anymore but I haven't nearly tried them all to be fair
Petronas44
236
Jul 28, 2017
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amoeba1126Also something to be aware of is that there are solid state amps out there that sound like some tube amps and there are some tube amps out there that sound like some solid states it's definitely not as black and white as you may think
amoeba1126
460
Jul 28, 2017
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Petronas44Hence me providing a precursor that this is only my personal opinion and that I am being an elitist with my remark. :D There is nothing "wrong" with a good solid state amp and they are definitely less maintenance than a tube amp. A lot of them sound really good too, like Cavalli's Liquid Gold or Crimson amps for example. That said, the warmth and harmonic distortion found only in tube amps reign supreme for me.
amoeba1126
460
Jul 28, 2017
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Petronas44There are some very warm SS amps like Cavalli Audio Liquid Gold that come close to good tube amps, but they don't quite bridge that gap.
Q-Prof
11
Jul 29, 2017
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amoeba1126Wow, thanks for the intricate details, nicely summarized and compared which is very helpful and all in one place. I appreciate your well written response and it sounds like... (lol no pun intended) that you know you stuff and your response was very helpful! Decisions, decisions... but you have given me more to consider and think about, moving forward.
Q-Prof
11
Jul 29, 2017
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Petronas44Well one thing, since the delivery is not till (probably after Christmas for us Canadians) maybe might be possible to have my cake and eat it too since I will have time to figure out, get use to the idea of that combination (more time to save or look for sales). I just hope that the sound improvement will be enough to justify the new 6xx phone, Jot Amp, and multibit DAC set-up... I know it is the one every one is all hyped up about (6xx) and is said to be the one to get at that price.
Q-Prof
11
Jul 29, 2017
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amoeba1126What experience have you had with solid state vs tube amps? I know from reading that this is the direction that most audiophiles go eventually.... I assume you still have a HD6XX and use Tube AMP/DAC set-up - what are you using? I know you already pointed me in the direction of Bottlehead Crack, Lyr/Vahalla, or Little Dot ... I have done some electronics, and hear that the Bottlehead can be built from parts (but will still be pricey from what I have read).... are they really going to be a big improvement over say a Jot... or is this a marginal really fine increment improvement and /or sound variance?
amoeba1126
460
Jul 29, 2017
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Q-ProfFor SS, I have had or have the following amps:
- JDS Labs Objective 2
- JDS C5
- Grace m9xx
- Burson Soloist
- Cavalli Liquid Gold
I haven't heard the Jot myself yet, though I tend to find non-tube Schiit amps a bit on the bright side. The Bottlehead Crack on the other hand, is very warm and smooth. There are people who will build it for you, but if you build it yourself, you could call it your own. Keep in mind though, that the Bottlehead Crack is an OTL tube amp, meaning it's primarily form high impedance headphones like the HD6XX. While it would with other more efficient headphones, the pairing wouldn't be what one would call ideal. For the HD6XX, I would say that it is a significant improvement as the two pair very well together.
I haven't heard the Jot myself yet, though I tend to find non-tube Schiit amps a bit on the bright side. The Bottlehead Crack on the other hand, is very warm and smooth. There are people who will build it for you, but if you build it yourself, you could call it your own. Keep in mind though, that the Bottlehead Crack is an OTL tube amp, meaning it's primarily form high impedance headphones like the HD6XX. While it would with other more efficient headphones, the pairing wouldn't be what one would call ideal. For the HD6XX, I would say that it is a significant improvement as the two pair very well together.
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I am wondering what kind of improved quality listening is there with Sennheiser HD 6XX and/or the Fostex TH-X00. I have read comments and a lot comes down to sound preference, i.e. warmth, base, etc. and the 6XX type is the standard that all phones are compared or measured from and the Fostex are a step up further, both requiring appropriate DAC and Amp to get the full benefit from these audiophile phones. I don’t have direct access to these phones to test so I am looking for some opinions on this with some logical reasoning behind your suggestions. My question is, in my situation having the PC37X phones, is it worth having a second pair on top for what will probably end up being about $700 + CDN more. I don’t have an issue with the wait for the 6XX or spending an extra 200 for the Fostex, but is one, the other, or both really worthy to spend the extra money on. Does anyone here have the PC37X and 6XX/Fostex phones and/or is an experienced audiophile that can clearly recommend/guide me on this?