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DeathbyMusic
157
Oct 28, 2015
Doesn't look like this drop will get past 200. I guess there are a lot of uncertainties regarding this one. Wonder why. 500 dollars isn't particularly much for a DAC/AMP and coming from a well-known manufacturer most would agree that it's not a high-risk investment. I do wish that this thing had independent amplifier function as well though.
fuzzybaffy
28
Oct 28, 2015
DeathbyMusicI'm pretty sure it will go past 200... there are still 9 days left. But I agree with you there seems to be uncertainty with this one. I think it's because people already know it's not actually a "$2000 DAC/Amp priced at $500". They see it as a straight-up "$500 DAC/Amp", in which there's a lot of other options.
That said... Grace is a pretty reputable company, and I have no doubt this is a great product. If I had the $500, I'd buy it without auditioning it in a heartbeat. Too bad I don't have the cash at the moment.
DeathbyMusic
157
Oct 28, 2015
fuzzybaffyMaybe I should pull out of this one and wait for proper reviews from people who actually bought the unit.
Ormia
31
Oct 28, 2015
fuzzybaffyWould you mind giving some of the alternative options at the $500 price point? Its just too bad that not many have experienced the m9xx yet, and thus the uncertainty.
Ormia
31
Oct 28, 2015
DeathbyMusicI bet many others in the drop are having the same thoughts.
fuzzybaffy
28
Oct 28, 2015
OrmiaI was really thinking about the popular $300 stacks and all-in-ones. Sure, not quite the same class as a $500, but I'd imagine any of those Schiit stacks, O2 stacks, Aune all-in-ones come into play when someone is considering a $500 DAC/amp.
fuzzybaffy
28
Oct 28, 2015
DeathbyMusicIt's up to you... I imagine that's what a lot of other people are thinking, too.
Really, though... I have a hard time believing this will be a "bad" product. It's definitely not going to be an item where people say "oh my god, this was such a rip-off". I can see how for someone just starting out in this hobby, they might want to compare down to the single-digit dollar value all the available options, but really... you use it for a few years, and then you move on to newer and better items.
DeathbyMusic
157
Oct 28, 2015
fuzzybaffyI'm sure it's not a bad item. The problem is that there just aren't many reliable sources out there to tell us exactly how this thing measures up to the competition. Most decent products at this price will not be BAD. Just different or maybe lacking in one way or another that someone else will happily step into refute. I might sit this one out. I was one of the first to jump in on the drop too.
Ormia
31
Oct 28, 2015
DeathbyMusicSame here. I don't have that many multiples of $500 to spend. It will be my first serious dac/amp, and it will be a long long long while before i can afford another dac/amp. So this must be better than the competition for me to go through with it. At the moment, we only have an n=3 reviews/first impressions regarding the unit. I would like a greater number of more critical reviews so that I would be totally sold on the m9xx.
Neotribal
53
Oct 28, 2015
fuzzybaffyOne of the reviewers who has hands-on time with the m9XX said that this device is in a totally different league compared to the o2 stack, and that the o2 setup was just "okay" in their opinion (I'm guessing that this is in comparison to the extremely high-end gear that they've had the opportunity to audition). There is a lot of great conversation happening about this little device over at the Head-Fi thread.
fuzzybaffy
28
Oct 28, 2015
NeotribalI didn't mean to say that the O2 stack would be "as good" as this, or vise versa. But that for people considering a $500 item, $300 items would still be in consideration (for saving that extra $200 or whatnot). Things don't necessarily have to be in exactly the same price point and/or quality-level to be in competition with one another.
DeathbyMusic
157
Oct 28, 2015
NeotribalI've been refreshing and following the m9xx impressions like many others for days now. I'm gonna go nuts. Lol. I've read most opinions as well, and pretty much everyone concurred that the m9xx will be superior to the O2. The thing is, with the limited reviews, we only have a few. VERY FEW to depend on for their reviews. In my opinion, if this thing is just 1.5-2 times better than the O2 combo it's money well spent. But at this point, it's more wishful thinking. Also, so far, have only read 1 review from project86.
TheRealVlad
91
Oct 28, 2015
NeotribalIf your going to go of headfi threads its the end of you. Many headfi reviews are sponsored by many of these companies (paid) for positive reviews. Even small time reviewers often sent these items for review and they keep it (paid) . headfi is nothing but a money making machine. Also many people there do not have many products but they give opinions on it and even recommend.
I tried amps and dacs from $99 to $2000 in past few years and there is very little difference. Most important thing is clean signal. As long as it's clean and neutral you are ok. Go read Ken Rockwell article on iPhone 5 dac and amp. Its better then 90% of stuff out there. Its backed by measurements.
The best amp I had for money ever was objective 2. If you have basic setup I can recommend that. If you have need for more connections and features you may need to step up and spend little More.
DeathbyMusic
157
Oct 28, 2015
TheRealVlad^ Basically the reason for my paranoia. Lol. Yeah, I heard about the "rumors" resulting in biased reviews.
dalethorn
193
Oct 28, 2015
TheRealVladIn some respects the value drops sharply above the O2+ODAC. But once you get into it in depth, the differences can astound you. This product looks like an audiophile wet dream to me.
Neotribal
53
Oct 28, 2015
TheRealVladLook, I'm sorry, but you can't start a sentence by asking people to question the validity of paid reviews, and then mention Ken Rockwell... Photographers all over the world cry in pain when his name is mentioned as a talking point. Look, I get it: his site is high up in the Google search results, he posts relevant tests about products, and he restates relevant facts and specs on his site so that people think he is a reliable source of information. ALL the links on his site that point to a retailer are referral links, he creates content to flip a profit, and should not be referenced as an unbiased party. The guy is a good resource if you need to find aggregated specs or a general overview of how a product works, but he is a fountain of misinformation and regularly injects opinion and questionable value judgement about the products he reviews. Entertaining (and partially informative) to read, no doubt, but a terrible choice for empirical data.
TL:DR The dude is a salesman (which you advise against). Read here to see it in his own words, and for some more conversation about him: http://nikonites.com/general-photography/2909-ken-rockwell-facts-post23935.html#post23935
That being said, I realize that some reviewers on there are paid to talk up a product, but is that any different from amazon reviews? or Yelp? Or any other online resource? cutting through the BS is a necessary skill nowadays. I thank you and appreciate that you're warning against visiting Head-fi threads to avoid being sold snake oil as audio equipment, but I think that having the community aspect outweighs the downsides. Being able to use that along with other information to inform my decisions is not a bad approach, I think. I don't see any $1200 USB cables in my future, if that helps put things into perspective.
avitron142
134
Oct 28, 2015
DeathbyMusicI should have a (very frank) review of this soon once I get it tomorrow - hang in there!
avitron142
134
Oct 28, 2015
TheRealVlad...and here's the conspiracist. If you believe that there's no difference between dac/amps why are you here in the first place?
Before talking about biased reviews, keep in mind that most of the big time reviewers already have quite a few items already better than the product they're given as a sample - making the bias little to none. Everybody screams "bias", but in reality it's a stupid claim since whatever rating they give the product (honest or not) they're keeping it anyway.
As for myself, I have a little money saved up for the Aune X1S that came out, if I don't get to win the raffle for it. I enjoyed it more than both the Objective stack and the Schiit Stack (as well as all the portable options such as the Geek Out etc. etc.), although that is YMMV. It's a shame I don't have it at the moment to do a A/B comparison when the m9XX comes tomorrow, although I took down a lot of notes from the listening tests so I should at least be able to make some sort of comparison between the two.
So before we go "eh, he's biased", let's all remember that I have other dac/amp options, will likely not be working for Massdrop again due to the rarity of collaborations, and have nothing in the way of an honest review. Oh, and I'm a college student, so I don't go buying everything I see :D . I hope this helps!
Neotribal
53
Oct 28, 2015
fuzzybaffyYeah the decision really boils down to: "Does it seem like this thing is worth twice as much as this other thing?". Sound quality is not the only consideration (even though it's the primary focus), the build quality, feature-set, interface, aesthetic, etc. all come into play (for me, at least). The level of engineering that went into this is pretty evident, the o2 stack in comparison feels kinda homebrew. Not that "homebrew" is necessarily a bad thing (I have a BH Crack).
Ormia
31
Oct 28, 2015
NeotribalYou're on the money with this comment. And I'm glad to read all this helpful discussion.
dtw898
158
Oct 28, 2015
TheRealVladDon't discount the positive reviews just because you think they were paid to review. Most seasoned Hi-Fi shoppers know when a reviewer is bullsh*tting. That is why reviewers are citing name of the song in their review to give the reader a sense of reference. Often times, I found their reviews were very close to the mark when I already owned the item being reviewed.
If you can't tell the difference b/w a $99 and $2,000 amp/dacs, I encourage you to try a different headphone or CIEM. It is safe to say that the more high-end the headphone/CIEM is, the more you can tell the difference. But then, if you are satisfied with your existing headphone/CIEM (which couldn't distinguish b/w the two amp/dacs), then you are correct to not to waste money on the more expensive counterpart.
From my opinion, I found the reviewers of the m9xx to be frank and straight-forward and gave enough information that I could relate to. I'm convinced that it is a good amp/dac worthy of buying in my pursue to improving my listening experience.
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