Hello, I just joined, primarily for the audiophile products. Looking at purchasing the NHT C3 speakers for our new living room. Space is about 15 feet wide by 33 long and they will fire long ways. Space is just for general listening, music room with all equipment is downstairs, so hoping they will fill it with sound nicely. Cheers.
Mar 18, 2024
On "No Surprises" by Radiohead, lossless 16/44, the bass is distorted. Distortion is even worse on "High & Dry." The bass on the Massdrop x HIFIMAN Bolt is better for these songs, a little fat but less distorted! And deeper! I guess it could be my ears, but I don't think this headphone aka HD650 deserves its reputation.
I want to add that the Massdrop x HIFIMAN Bolt has rather poor highs (eg on Polythene Pam), so I'm not claiming its a better headphone.
Edit: Just listened to it on my reference amp. Recording's not that great, but I hear zero bass distortions. It is clean and tight.
I get better results from even the modest Final E2000, FH1, Fidelio X2 sourcing from older Fiio X3 or Hiby R3. And No Surprises is fine from an iMac to Adam F5. It's not like I'm expecting fidelity for Bassnectar. Magni 3 is cutting corners, it seems that 6xx is perhaps a niche headphone.
Newer people should know they'll be getting diminished performance at the ground level.
It's ok, but newer people should know they'll be getting diminished performance at the ground level, no matter what the amp.
I should have had more patience and gone for the TR-X00 Mahogany, but wanted to find out about the standard fare. Thanks for the feedback.
Budget amps like the Aune T1 drives these with much better clarity than the Magnitude, though the DAC on chip plays a big part too. Sure an amp at X2 price will perform better, but so will an amp at X10, these cans don't stop scaling which is why so many people love them.
The Massdrop CTH work really well with these. And the Mahogany is a good choice when starting out with the Fostex's :)
THD: -143 dB with 300ohm; -122 dB with 16 ohm (balanced - single ended shows similar relationship). 21 dB is like what, a little over 10x worse? Not the best of examples but it is something to ponder about.
650's do have like 7 or 8 % THD distortion @ 20 Hz 100dB SPL which is higher than many headphones but not a lot higher (taken from memory off of innerfedelity website - I don't feel like double checking the graphs right now - I no longer trust anything Head-fi does which is who reported THD for these on massdrop.). Anything above 0.5% I heard becomes audible.
With that said, 650's are amazing elsewhere in many ways. And the bass 650's do have is beautiful as long as you don't force it to play too much.
And... could be the amp (shoulder shrug). It's a reasonable conclusion. Why do I keep reading about how crappy the magni 3 is >.> what happened!
It is hard to say whether an amp can deliver power optimally to a particular load by looking at basic specs (most specs make no sense since there is only 1 single point of reference), however we do know that power can be delivered optimally if the output impedance is well matched to the load impedance. Ever have an amp with both a high impedance and low impedance output? The HD6XX will always sound better on the high impedance output, and congested on the low impedance. This is also why people often report that OTL amps pair really well with HD6XX's because of their inherently high output impedance.
You're correct that high impedance means better grip, SNR and crosstalk are also lower with higher impedance headphones. I do wish more headphones come in higher impedance, but overall manufacturers are dropping impedance to appeal to the wider market.
The lack of sub bass is what makes the 650/ 6xx a compromise. A lot of music since the 70s have sub bass more than 6xx can handle. I like that there's no piercing highs but it feels like the bottom has dropped out. Don't even think about taking on a Seven Nation Army with 6xx.
But yeah, Aja by Steely Dan sounds good, so 6xx is good enough for less demanding but well produced music. No amp can improved the sub bass on 6xx -- is that right? And yes, I think the X3 line out > Magni 3 is distorting at high volume. The problem is that I'd have to spend more for a good amp with 6xx than just getting a Fostex TR-X00 with proper bass.
But it's interesting to see what compromises audiophiles are willing to excuse, and how hard won are increments of good sound.
And if you don't have an amp that costs more than the headphone, you'll hear distortion at higher volumes that won't be heard in say the Final Audio E2000 at 1/10 the total cost.
And remember, these headphones have a MSRP of $500, so a Magni is only 1/5th of the cost of the headphone.
Soundstage wise, I do think they are very good and again, natural. Distance between instruments is correct rather than exaggerated like on the cheaper AD700 or more expensive HD800. On a good amp, soundstage realism is on the same level as a Focal Utopia.
The strengths of the HD6XX is the midrange, and they are great for acoustic and voices.
I'm saying that bass lighter headphones are not realistic, and unrealistic might be kind as description for sound profiles that cause hearing loss. Happily, the 6xx isn't ear piercing.
It depends, if realism is a string trio or folk guitars, then yes neutral might be lightweight. If we're talking music since 1967-70, then we need to go back to the drawing board. Or it could mean I just like more sub/mid bass richness that doesn't get muddy.
MSRP is fantasy, especially considering inflation, tech improvements, and supply chain improvements. The HD 650 was selling for $300 when I bought the Fidelio X2, and it went back up $50. The 6xx have always sold for $199. In any case, the Magni 3 doesn't do much for the X2 (over a Fiio X3) and I think that the 6xx needs something better.
It's a bit silly of me to whine too much about what's still really budget gear.
I've got TOTL reference level gears running the HD6XX and have not found anything that beats them in overall enjoyment.
Not wanting to argue with you, but once you have a better DAC & amp, give these another chance. Peace.