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Massdrop x Apogee Takumi Nakiri 7" Vegetable Knife
01 / 08
Massdrop x Apogee Takumi Nakiri 7" Vegetable Knife
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Product Description
Our latest collaboration with Apogee is the nakiri: a 7-inch vegetable-cutting extraordinaire designed to complement the other knives in the Takumi series. Crafted with a thin AUS-10 stainless steel blade, a nearly straight edge, and a squared-off tip, it excels in chopping and mincing vegetables Read More
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xilvar
50
Jul 30, 2019
I already have a nakiri so I likely won’t buy this one however I wanted to note some of the advantages of a nakiri in general purpose use.
- the edge is fairly close to flat and the blade has a lot of width all the way to the tip. Cutting/chopping some food and then being able to use virtually the entire surface of the knife to lift it to bowl or pot is really great. I use it this way for both meat and veggies.
- The edge flatness allows cutting to the board with far less hanging threads of onion, skin, whatever.
- The edge flatness and consistent width makes it far easier to sharpen both with a guided system and with a stone.
- Its a knife. It works fine to cut anything including meat.
- Its thinness relative to say a Chinese chopper or Chinese chef knife makes it perform much more similarly to a normal chef.
reswright
3850
Jun 17, 2019
If you want to be relatively assured that you're getting a good kitchen knife for your money, but you don't have a head for alloys and carbides and grind angles and all that, and you just want one thing to look for right off the bat that will tell you whether you're in the right store, or the right part of the store?
Look for a phrase like "forged from a single blank of high carbon stainless steel".
That's it. There's more to it than that of course but if you want a good place to start, start there. The primary difference between cheapass knives and midlevel working knives is that cheapass kitchen knives are stamped and better kitchen knives are forged. If you see a knife with a bolster but you don't see that phrase, you're getting something that had a block of metal cosmetically welded to the frame to look like a bolster. And if you get a knife that talks quality quality quality but doesn't mention being forged, all that talk is pure BS.
Why do you care? Because the act of forging the steel blank into the shape of the knife makes it immensely stronger compared to just rolling out some sheet steel and stamping out some metal knives. It realigns the alloy matrix, it gives the knife more resilience and spring. Makes it less likely to catastrophically fail, i.e. crack. Your knife looks hard and stiff but every time you use it, that matrix has to flex a little, and if it doesn't, it starts to crack. Over time those cracks become larger even though you need a microscope to see them. Then one day you go to slice something and your knife literally splits into two pieces because the cracks got big enough to break wide open.
Look at the difference between these two listings:
http://www.wusthof.com/7-nakiri-hollow-edge-1914
This is from Wusthof's cheapest line of knives. They aren't forged, they're stamped. See how it doesn't have a bolster? See what the ad copy says and doesn't say? This knife will be a step up from a cheapo brand but if you never use a better knife, you'll never know what you're missing. And take the point: even companies like Wusthof are happy to make cheap knives and sell them to people who have never been trained to know any better.
http://www.wusthof.com/7-nakiri-hollow-edge-1913
This is from the Classic line, their main line of knives. See the different ad copy? See how they lead with the most important bullet - it's forged from a single piece of steel? See that bolster? That's what a better grade of chef knife looks like and that's what it has going for it.
My advice to you if you like cooking is that you owe it to yourself to buy a good knife, not just an expensive one. You will use it all over your kitchen, you may use it for 20 years or longer, and every time you use it you'll be getting more benefit from having paid for a good one with the best ergonomics and safest, most precise construction, so it's worth getting it right and going with a solid brand.
I'm biased toward Wusthof but the same holds true when you're looking at other premier brands like Henckels and Shun -- hold out for something forged. You'll be amazed at the difference it makes in your work.
reswright
3850
Jun 13, 2019
The ad copy says the knife has a stainless steel bolster. The knife in the picture does not appear to even have a bolster.
It doesn't say whether the knife was forged or cut. It says some things about the steel being impact welded, but that's different from knife forging -- impact welding is how you join two dissimilar alloys together. Forging is when the steel stock is actually hammered and then ground into the shape of the blade, milling is when an ingot of steel is machined down into the shape of the blade, but die cut steel is just punched out from sheets of stock metal on a press.
It says it's got an AUS-10 steel blade at a few points, and at others acknowledges that it's only AUS-10 at the core, w/ inexpensive stainless and nickel steel layers on the outside. The grind angle isn't that aggressive for a nakiri.
And it says the blade has a hardness of 61 but that's also only the core. If you Rockwell test the entire knife you will get a lower hardness determined partially by the outer layers of inexpensive stainless. If the impact weld was done well it might be decent, but not 61.
The bit about the sides of the knife being irregular and that helping food not to stick, that's yes and no. It will keep bigger things from sticking but it will also be harder to clean than a flat ground, non-etched edge. As a guy who uses his kitchen knives often, I think I'll stick with hollow ground nakiris like my Wusthof classic.
Nakiris are useful knives in the kitchen. They got that part right.
Benjabooly
373
Jun 17, 2019
reswrightThe bolster is on the back of the handle for balance, and most high end knives that arnt Wusthof or zwilling (and even their nicer stuff) is a harder steel clad with softer steel, it makes the knife less fragile and more stain resistant, no need to have anything BUT the core at 61HRC what so ever. The knife is also just as easy to clean, its not etched but polished.
reswright
3850
Jun 17, 2019
BenjaboolyNo, it doesn't have a reverse bolster either (which is what you're describing).
https://drop.com/buy/massdrop-x-apogee-vital-8-inch-chefs-knife
See that knife? See the thick stainless between the blade and the handle, and again at the end of the handle? That is the bolster and the reverse bolster, respectively. On a kitchen knife, that's how they look.
When a flat kitchen blade just goes straight into the handle that's what we call 'not having a bolster'. The metal that you're talking about that's visible in the handle and at the end of it is the tang. That is also something that is perhaps most usefully defined as 'also not a bolster'.
Now, if you want to have a discussion about knife steels that people use in the kitchen and on high end knives and whether or not 'most' of them are multiple layer constructions, we can definitely have that. It's going to be an extremely easy discussion because it's going to consist of opening up a few knife store pages and looking at the available distribution of steel on those knives. Takes maybe ten seconds. Fast like a bunny! Then we can zip on over to a couple of webpages that talk about what sort of Rockwell hardness most premier kitchen knife makers go for and we can see it's typically in the middle 50s, because if you try and have high hardness kitchen knives they chip. You need special serrations to really keep that from happening, that act as standoffs from the cutting edge. Otherwise the edge gets chewed up with regular use. Little chips of steel in the food are kinda a no bueno, and so are difficult regrinds.
A multipurpose kitchen knife with a hardness above 60 is a contradiction in terms. It only sounds good. In reality knives like that are very special purpose and the only people who are good with them are very good with knives and using them carefully. Here they are being sold to people who go 'hey, that sounds awesome'. And it does, if you don't know better.
Kitchen steel knives are meant to deform before they chip. If the edge rolls over, you work it back with the honing steel. They're meant to be sharpened a lot more often than a pocket knife with high value PM steel. And you want them to be easy to sharpen as a result. Not with a hard grind, but a honing steel to realign the edge. This is a knife that's meant for someone who wants to be seen cooking food, but I'll warn you: it is not a knife that is meant for a cook.
Finally, the design -- if you want a nakiri with texture on it, get one that's got hammermarks on it. People who have bought this knife are reporting in the discussion that it's comparatively hard to keep clean, which doesn't seem surprising as it's the first thing I thought of. It really only takes one good case of food poisoning before you start caring as to whether or not your chef knife is easy to clean. Hammer marks will be much easier to clean than this -- very old school, very cool and effective, this is just a stamped pattern that's meant to catch some of the 'damascus' sales juice before it runs out. Real damascus kitchen knives, even good ones, even real wootz knives when used in the kitchen, are known for just one thing if you leave them in the kitchen long enough: rust.
How many cooking shows have you seen where the chef is using a pretty luxed up set of cookware, or really good knives, or top end gear. Probably a few, right? Well, how many times have you seen them using something that even looked like damascus?
Yeah, there's a reason you don't see that much and have to hunt for it, and find it mostly from really questionable brands. It's not a good fit for the kitchen at the end of the day, even though it's gorgeous.
If people have these and love them, it's really no skin off my nose. (I mean, I'd hate to think they were buying knives that no one liked anything about, right?) De gustibus non disputandum est. I only know what they look like to me -- I cooked professionally for years which is my primary point of reference for kitchen knives, and these knives don't have bolsters, and are kinda made out of geek bait if you ask me. I'd never buy one. Some of the other Apogee knives in stock here don't look as bad - best of luck with them! I'll be sticking with my Wusthof classics.
(Edited)
14themoney
1395
May 16, 2019
I have one of these in high carbon, by Gihei. I can't recall if it is white or blue steel. It's a wonderful knife. Made in Japan. The specs suggest that this should cut like Jack the ripper. Like others, I would spend a few more bucks and get one made in Japan.
Carboh
17
May 14, 2019
Any possibility of adding European "Droppers" to kitchen knife Drops in the near future?
Eagerly awaiting!
JaleesaG
1550
Marketing Team
Apr 8, 2019
Hi all,
We’re excited to announce that the Massdrop x Apogee Takumi 7” Nakiri Kitchen Knives have arrived at our warehouse and shipping will begin soon. We now estimate we’ll begin shipping by early next week.
If you need to change your delivery address, please contact Community Support through your transactions page (https://www.massdrop.com/transactions) by Thursday, April 11th at 5:00 pm PT.
We look forward to you receiving and enjoying your knife soon!
swimjay
115
Mar 21, 2019
If this knife is made in China, I wonder if it's a casualty of Trump's trade war with that nation. Could this be why it's so delayed? (It's now 3/21/19).
I've canceled my order; am no longer confident this knife will be well-made, given the inevitable erosion of good will between us, and possible subsequent resentment, caused by the way Trump has handled trade relations with the Chinese. (It's now 3/22).
(Edited)
JaleesaG
1550
Marketing Team
Feb 27, 2019
Hi all,
We have an update on the Massdrop x Apogee Takumi 7” Nakiri Vegetable Knife.
Unfortunately, we’re tracking behind our original estimated ship date and delivery time will be impacted.
We apologize for the delay. If you prefer not to wait the additional time, you can cancel your order on your transactions page: https://www.massdrop.com/transactions.
Stay posted for more information, including a new estimated shipping date. If you have any questions, please feel free to reach out.
Thank you so much for your patience. We look forward to you receiving and enjoying your Massdrop x Apogee Takumi 7” Nakiri Vegetable Knife soon.
Copsvsninjas
3
Mar 18, 2019
JaleesaGAny update on when this will ship out?
How about a really rough off the record estimate that I won't hold you to?
one week? one month? three months? one year?
JaleesaG
1550
Marketing Team
Jan 3, 2019
Hi everyone,
We’re checking in with an update on the Takumi 7" Nakiri Vegetable Knife. Production is well underway and we’re on track to meet the February 28 estimated ship date.
We’ll be back with another update once the knives arrive at our warehouse!
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