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MSQRD
38
Dec 7, 2017
Hello friends. I was comparing these to the HD 6XX (like many people) but ended up buying both! I wanted give you some of my thought that hopefully could help you decide which one if you're on the edge.
Lows: I think the HE 4XX out preforms the HD 6XXs here. The bass is much more tight and punchy but that's not to say that the bass isn't present in the HD 6XXs. Matter of fact, the bass quantity is about the same, just the HE 4XX sound a little sharper / puncher. They might extend a little deeper too, but not by a lot.
Mids: the HD 6XXs wins out here. Vocals sound much more present / clear. This is mainly due to the improved soundstage in the HD 6XX. The mids are not missing in the HE 4XXs, but just not as nice as the HD 6XXs.
Highs: I think many people have stated that the HE 4XX clearly win as far as highs, but for me, it's not that big of a run off. I think they are a it clearer, but I'm not sure they are that much more present as people have stated, although they are slightly.
Soundstage: HD 6XXs clearly wins here. They sound much more wide and concert like. Vocals feel like they are present with you in the room.
Detail: HE 4XX clearly wins here. You can here more instruments, more clearly.
Comfort: They are both fairly comfortable, but the larger circular cups on the HE 4XXs fit my hard head better.
Overall: At first, I was pretty dissatisfied with the HE 4XX performance. They definitely sound more "dull" at first listen than the HD 6XXs. That said, while doing this review, i grew to like them much more. They have more more clarity throughout the frequency spectrum. It's true, the HD 6XX sound more lively, but there's something to be said about the HE 4XX clarity. Unfortunately, they do not respond to equalization as well as the HD 6XX do. Also, they are a little harder to drive and seem more "finicky". At first, for me, the HD 6XXs were the clear winner, but now I'm not as sure. I think if most people were to give the HE 4XXs a chance, they'll grow to like them much more than their initial listen. It's a toss up. It really depends on your personal preference. I think for most people the HD 6XX might edge out as a winner, but not for everyone. The one piece of advice I'll give you is not to buy both. I should have saved up and bought one pair of nicer cans! Damn massdrop always giving us amazing deals!
NOTE: I listened via my Macbook Pro using Boom 2 connected to Bravo Audio Ocean Mini
Wolffi
20
Dec 7, 2017
MSQRDShit Just ordered the HE4xx aswel as I'm waiting for the HD6xx.............
ikhan
80
Dec 7, 2017
MSQRDHow solid is the build quality? Edit: On the HE4XX.
Wolffi
20
Dec 7, 2017
ikhanLooking at this picture I would say that the constuction looks weak. It also looks like the paint of the slide adjustment scrapes of quickly. So I am really questioning if I should cancel my order...........
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ikhan
80
Dec 7, 2017
WolffiHmm I see what you mean about the paint, but if that happens, a sharpie can take care of it. Also, that (the skinny arms) right there is spring steel, which is rather durable, so I have no concern with bends/snaps. My main concern is if that plastic part where L/R is written is durable. I don't want it snapping off in like 4 months. Personally though, I don't think it gets better for $170 with all things considered, so you should stay.
Woobs
4
Dec 7, 2017
ikhanTougher than it looks. I had similar doubts. When I twist holding the L/R part, the headband flexes, not the joint. No scratching from adjustments either. It's really smooth. More worried about it becoming too loose over time.
ikhan
80
Dec 7, 2017
WoobsGotcha. Thanks!
MDuh
74
Dec 7, 2017
MSQRDdid you burned them in? I just got mine so didn't burned it yet and first impression: I disagree completely on the things you said about lows and detail. I could hear more subtle differences on the instruments with the HD 6xx. I prefer the soundstage of the HE4xx though weirdly, It feels more natural to me
MSQRD
38
Dec 7, 2017
MDuhInteresting. My HD 6XXs are well burned in. Had them for a while. Try comparing while listening to the deep bass of Alt-J - "3WW" and let me know your thoughts. I'm not expert, but the attack / clarity seems moderately better (some may say significantly). Have any tracks that really highlight the difference in low instrument separation?
As far as the soundstage goes, it depends on how you define soundstage. I've seen it talked about in two different ways. As far as the clear separation of left and right channels, I would agree that the HE 4XXs achieve this much better. Instrument separation is overall better in the HE 4XXs. As far as the ability (or illusion) to hear the venue in which it was recorded, the HD 6XXs seem better. Songs seem more spacious and wide. Vocals seem more real and present.
It's really interesting how In doing this review, I grew to like the HE 4XXs much more than I initially did. I really can't pick a clear winner. I can say that I would pick either headphones over my AKG 7XXs. I LOVE the comfort of the AKG 7XXs, but the HD 6XXs outperform them in many / all aspects and have a similar sound profile.
Build Quality: They seem very solid; they feel great in the hands. I might be a little worried about scratching the paint (not that i have scratches now, just that they *seem* like they may scratch). I'm not at all worried about them breaking in anyway.
Hodie
15
Dec 7, 2017
MSQRDI think you're mixing up sound stage and imaging. Good review, though, helped.
Pings
264
Dec 8, 2017
MSQRDI would say that in general the HD6XX have a wider sound stage but by much at all, if any it's that close, or maybe less than the HE4XX. For sure some sounds on the HE4XX sound further than others. This would be imaging and I would say it's not even close the HE4XX blow the HD6XX out the water. With the HD6XX pretty much everything sounds like it is coming from the same distance. With the HE4XX it sounds like all sorts of things are coming from different distances. Listen to the sound stage, and imaging/3D positional audio of this song. Bubbles by Yosi Horikawa really illuminates the differences between the two when it comes to sound stage and imaging. If you ask me HE4XX>HD6XX when it comes to sound stage and imaging, and it's not very close.
https://yosihorikawa.bandcamp.com/track/bubbles
Wolffi
20
Dec 8, 2017
PingsMight the "Sound further" be caused by the angled earpads? As the idea is that you sort of think you're listening to speakers due to that. Newest Bowers & Wilkins even angle the drivers within the headphone instead of using angled pads.
Pings
264
Dec 8, 2017
WolffiI doubt it. My AD700x had an angled driver and my AD1000x didn't but the AD1000x has a wider soundstage. I'm not too sure what causes this effect but I don't think it's an angle driver or the pad.
Pings
264
Dec 8, 2017
WolffiOh yeah as someone who both owns of these headphones the HE4XX have superior build quality. I have no idea why anyone would think the plastic design of the HD6XX are a superior build to metal frame of the HE4XX. Metal frame > plastic frame always.
ikhan
80
Dec 8, 2017
PingsIm reading that the bass is rolled off and it isn't "linear." Is that really an issue?
Pings
264
Dec 8, 2017
ikhanNo I wouldn't say so. The HE4XX has pretty good bass extension. Especially when compared to the HD6XX. HE4XX lows don't bleed off into the mids like the HD6XX do, no Veil either.
Wolffi
20
Dec 8, 2017
PingsI agree, but it is in the case of the 4xx i am talking about the plastics parts of the build. They seem glued on a bit.
Pings
264
Dec 8, 2017
WolffiThat still doesn't make sense. The ear cup is one solid piece of plastic and the frame is all metal. The build quality of the HE4XX is superior.
Motorrad
2898
Dec 9, 2017
MSQRDIt's been a while since I've heard one, but I would suspect that ocean mini favors the 4xx. Also...time to step it up and get a DAC. Heh.
Brumledb
72
Dec 9, 2017
MSQRDThanks for the comparison. I have the Senn 6xx (but haven’t got to listen to them yet) and have been on the fence about ordering the HE4xx as well. Seems like these two are very similar with some preferring the 6xx and some the 4xx. Guess I need to just save my money and move up to the th-xoo’s or the e-mu teaks.
spronk
176
Dec 11, 2017
PingsI own a 4XX, as well as HD650 and HD600. I owned HD6XX for a few weeks, and I owned HD580s. My 600s are over 10 years old now. I'm not sure I'd agree with your statements. The HD600 and 650 plastic, and I presume the 6XX, is reinforced with loose carbon fibres, so it's pretty strong. Unless you try to snap it, it's unlikely to snap from normal use. It's a pretty well built headphone, even if it doesn't really feel that way to begin with.
The HE4XX seems solid in the frame, but the adjuster caps I'm not sure about. At this stage I wouldn't give the nod to either.
Wolffi
20
Dec 11, 2017
spronkGreat comparison, mine should arrive somewhere this or next week. I'll see which I think is build best.
Pings
264
Dec 11, 2017
spronkI'm just comparing metal to plastic. A lot of Fanboys will say a lot of things about the things they like. I don't understand the comparison to metal and plastic. Plastic is never the best build quality or is the HD6XX even compare to the HD600. I've literally seen even on this post people say that the metal scrapes against the ear cut not knowing that there's a gap there. Honestly I think a lot of these comparisons have a touch of fanboyism. I bet you the adjustment on the HE4XX is superior due to the design. Less moving parts always equals a longer life span, on any thing not just headphones. We are actually comparing one headphone which is 70% (HE4XX) metal to a headphone that is 95% (HE4XX) plastic if not more. We are not talking about carbon laced plastic either. This is cheap Chinese plastic if you own the HD6XX and the HD600 you should be able to tell the difference between the quality of plastic as I can and others who own these two headphones.
spronk
176
Dec 11, 2017
PingsThe finish is different and feels cheaper IMO on the 6XX, but I think the plastic is the same thermoplastic as the 600 and 650. The cup structure looks and feels identical.
I'd take the 6XX over an HE-400. That's the main reason why I'm not sure that the 4XX is built any better than it. It feels pretty nice right now, but will that hold up? Don't know.
But I wouldn't have any issues recommending the 6XX's build quality - it's good, and they are headphones that will last a decade or more, as I have experience with.
Pings
264
Dec 11, 2017
spronkIm not saying the build quality is bad I'm saying the bill quality on the HE4XX is better because it is. Metal is always better than plastic.
spronk
176
Dec 11, 2017
PingsIt can be better, but it's not always. The original 400 and 400s were evidence of that. Lower grade metal is worse than the plastic they use in the 6XX. The 4XX's metal feels better than the 400s, but I still have a few question marks over its long term durability. Time will tell I guess.
Pings
264
Dec 11, 2017
spronkYou're comparing the wrong models think HE4 not HE400i/s. Do you actually have this headphone?
Pings
264
Dec 11, 2017
spronkI forgot about the China rattle. Shake your actual HD600 and shake your HD6XX. There's a big difference in quality of plastic. Again the HE4XX have less moving parts and primarily made of metal. We are comparing a headphone which is 70% metal with less moving parts to a headphone that is 90% plastic with more moving parts. The build quality isn't even close and I have think I have stepped on a fanboy landmine.
audible
602
Dec 11, 2017
PingsYou know this 'fanboy' biz goes both ways, right? Calling people that here really borders on trolling.
spronk
176
Dec 11, 2017
PingsWhat do you mean China rattle? The HD6XX are made in Ireland - or at least my pair were. I had my HD6XX for weeks next to an HD600 and HD650 (evidence: https://www.reddit.com/r/Headphoneporn/comments/5ls3rp/the_hd_6_army_6xx_650_600/).
Yes these headphones rattle, but this is because of the way the capsule pivot works - the metal part pivots around the Z axis, and hits the plastic part when it reaches its movement limit. As I said, mine are doing just fine after >10 years of service, but if you own one of these and are worried about it, you can eliminate the rattle with a small piece of foam.
Yes, I own the HE4XX. Don't have a photo at the moment, but evidence: https://imgur.com/a/W1JQs
The headphones have the same number of moving parts that I can tell - two adjustable parts for headband. Both capsules pivot horizontally. Both capsules have a single vertical pivot point - the 6XX pivots around the metal piece that slides in and out of the headband, the 4XX pivots on a screw that comes quite tight from the factory but just seems to be some sort of compression washer, so I'm not sure about its durability.
Pings
264
Dec 11, 2017
audibleIt sure does but I'm honest about my opinions. Again we're talking about a headphone that the majority of it is made from metal and comparing it to a headphone where the major majority is plastic. We are not talking about polycarbon we are talking about just normal plastic. As far as I'm concerned I don't think this is subjective. And on top of that the guy was comparing it to the wrong model. Which made me believe he doesn't have the headphone because why compare it to the wrong model? Especially if he owns them he would know this but for some reason he kept comparing them to a different model. Fanboys tend to get online and give bad reviews and review things that they don't even have out of the love of a certain product. I am leaning towards this is the situation, I might be wrong but he's definitely getting the model mixed up and comparing them to a build style which these HE4XX are not. Granted he might be confused but none-the-less he's comparing them to the wrong model. The HE4 and the HE4XX have a completely different build style than what he was comparing it to. Again if he owns this headphone he should know this. Here I'll tell you what I'll give him the benefit of the doubt and he might be confused.
ikhan
80
Dec 12, 2017
MSQRDlol what have you started
audible
602
Dec 12, 2017
Pings"The Honesty of Opinion" The thing is: your fanboyism for the 4xx has been evident since you got them a few months ago. Before that it was the 6xx I guess and probably the 7xx before that. There's nothing wrong with that, but, you know, pot...kettle... Spronk is certainly a devotee of the HD's, but he seems to be arguing more about the efficacy of your premise than the superior or inferior build quality of either of these fine headphones. Now you're even suggesting that he's lying. I find the argument (metal>plastic) irrelevant. It breaks down to: the cupholder gimbal on the Senn is thermoplastic and on the 4xx it's metal. Coincidentally, the Senn is the lighter can. I've not seen the 6xx, but I would be surprised if the quality of the plastic was that different than the 650. With a 4xx and 650 in front of me and in hand, I find the 4xx clunky compared to the 650...guess I must be a fanboy too.
spronk
176
Dec 12, 2017
PingsSorry - I did mix up the older Hifiman model I was comparing to. It's not the 400i - I meant to compare to the original 400, the one with the similar headband and adjuster as the HE-4XX.
The only reason for the comparison of 4XX to the older model was to highlight the fact that it's difficult to say at this point whether the 4XX has good build quality, because the 400 had many issues down the line with it's fully metal system. Massdrop say they have worked with Hifiman to fix these, and they do feel solid as I've mentioned, but I wouldn't be confident stating they are a better built headphone to the 6XX having no data on longetivity of the "improved" version.
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