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Showing 1 of 37 conversations about:
GrumpyCamper
61
Feb 9, 2018
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I'm sad to see these stupid snake oil "audiophile" cables on MD. If you want to buy them for the looks or quality materials that is a valid reason, but if you think cables make the sound better you are fooling yourself.
Supperconductor
6
Feb 9, 2018
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GrumpyCamperI guess I'm fooling myself. Cables do make a difference on my HD600's. But I'm still on the stock cables because I'm a cheapskate. I'll probably go for a DIY solution at some point. And I encourage you to at least try out different cables (they don't have to be 'audiophile'). Every system and person is different. If you don't hear a difference, consider yourself lucky, you're saving money.
Crackie
9
Feb 9, 2018
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GrumpyCamperActually cables can do significant change to the presentation of the sound. Try some better cables and you will understand the difference.
GrumpyCamper
61
Feb 9, 2018
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CrackieThere is no evidence of that and no scientific basis to believe that changing cables would make an audible difference. Sure you can design a cable to modify the sound, but that would go against the purpose of a cable to transmit a signal.
Jaya212
13
Feb 9, 2018
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CrackieSince silver is more conductive than copper, those cables will actually sound better. The difference between cheaper copper cables and OFC copper is non-existent. The other difference is insulation, but again, that's a small difference. For most people the slight change isn't worth the price. Getting a better pair of headphones or DAC/amp is money better spent.
Crackie
9
Feb 9, 2018
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GrumpyCamperScrew the science. Use your ears.
If you care so much about the original purpose of something, take a perfectly plain headphone and listen to that boring sound.
If you care so much about the original purpose of something, take a perfectly plain headphone and listen to that boring sound.
Crackie
9
Feb 9, 2018
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Jaya212I agree with your standpoint for picking other equipment first.
However, the better the equipment, the better cable you need to have to utilize your good kits. I myself has a pretty nice set of equipment here and the purpose of switching cables and amps is to suit different moods. Synergy is also important as well. I suggest testing the actual cable before buying.
However, the better the equipment, the better cable you need to have to utilize your good kits. I myself has a pretty nice set of equipment here and the purpose of switching cables and amps is to suit different moods. Synergy is also important as well. I suggest testing the actual cable before buying.
junki
327
Feb 9, 2018
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GrumpyCamperAgreed. The people in this thread claiming cables matter is hilarious. Everyone already knows that in blind A/B testing, delusional audiophiles the likes of these posters can't tell the difference between real wires and a coat hanger. Because frankly there is none.
https://forums.audioholics.com/forums/threads/speakers-when-is-good-enough-enough.2512/page-2#post-15412 http://archimago.blogspot.sg/2015/06/musings-audio-cables-summary-non.html Specifically in response to the poor soul who believes one can hear the difference between silver and copper cables: http://archimago.blogspot.com/2016/11/measurements-crystal-cable.html
https://forums.audioholics.com/forums/threads/speakers-when-is-good-enough-enough.2512/page-2#post-15412 http://archimago.blogspot.sg/2015/06/musings-audio-cables-summary-non.html Specifically in response to the poor soul who believes one can hear the difference between silver and copper cables: http://archimago.blogspot.com/2016/11/measurements-crystal-cable.html
GrumpyCamper
61
Feb 9, 2018
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SupperconductorConfirmation bias and the placebo effect are real phenomenon. I suggest not worrying about the least important aspect of any audio system, the cables, and focus on the most, which is the speakers followed by the the source quality(in the digital age) then the amplification.
Bpendragon
36
Feb 9, 2018
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GrumpyCamperYeah, I work weekends as an audio engineer. The only time that cables make a difference is when replacing super sketch cables that have been horrifically abused and internally busted with new cables that don't have those same issues.
Supperconductor
6
Feb 9, 2018
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GrumpyCamperActually, the room is the biggest factor IME. And yes confirmation bias is a factor. Including when you don't expect to hear a difference. When I hear a difference, it's not always for the better. IMO YMMV, if you believe in absolutes, more power to you. Like I said, you're the lucky one.
GrumpyCamper
61
Feb 9, 2018
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SupperconductorThe room, yes but not really applicable to IEMs though the tips probably do factor in significantly. EDIT I'm sure I could fool myself into hearing something that is not there. That is really the reason the audiophile market exists. I start with the physics and if some concept doesn't make sense (i.e. violates the laws of physics or is so minuscule that the any change would be overwhelmed by other factors that are orders of magnitude more significant ) then it is not worth considering. Informal uncontrolled listening tests are worthless for confirming these type of differences anyway.
GrumpyCamper
61
Feb 9, 2018
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Jaya212Silver is somewhat more conductive than copper and the only way that would manifest is voltage drop over significant distance, not distortion of the signal.
asigal
140
Feb 10, 2018
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CrackieAre you serious? You do realize that your ears are run by your psychology, and your psychology is the least reliable measurement system in existence?
Expectation Bias? Placebo Affect? Sunken Ship Bias? Ever heard of those?
Well no, you haven't. Because you're a science denier apparently.
Expectation Bias? Placebo Affect? Sunken Ship Bias? Ever heard of those?
Well no, you haven't. Because you're a science denier apparently.
SStas
95
Jul 17, 2018
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junkiSaid the scientist to every new discovery across all of time... The Earth is flat; nope. Man has always existed on Earth without evolution; nope. The atom is the smallest particle in the universe: nope. The sun revolves around the Earth; nope. The speed of light is fixed; nope. Etc, etc, etc...
If you think science has got it all figured out, I guess you can join the club of stubborn narrow-minded thinkers who know-it-all, but are historically very, very wrong. We think we understand these concepts, but only a fool would say that everything is definitively proven. We know next to zero about how things work, relatively speaking, and especially how the brain can use input from auxiliaries, let alone the fact that we haven't refined machines and instrumentation to nearly the fidelity of the brain's capability. How can we measure these two things with a machine then?
We just pretend we know everything to help us sleep better at night.
For the record, I have never heard a difference in cables of relatively similar build qualities, but when I hear the "science bullies" coming to town and preventing the exploration of abstract ideas, it's time to remind everyone of history of modern scientific discovery..
If you think science has got it all figured out, I guess you can join the club of stubborn narrow-minded thinkers who know-it-all, but are historically very, very wrong. We think we understand these concepts, but only a fool would say that everything is definitively proven. We know next to zero about how things work, relatively speaking, and especially how the brain can use input from auxiliaries, let alone the fact that we haven't refined machines and instrumentation to nearly the fidelity of the brain's capability. How can we measure these two things with a machine then?
We just pretend we know everything to help us sleep better at night.
For the record, I have never heard a difference in cables of relatively similar build qualities, but when I hear the "science bullies" coming to town and preventing the exploration of abstract ideas, it's time to remind everyone of history of modern scientific discovery..
SStas
95
Jul 18, 2018
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xx0x0There is no scientific field called audiophile that I am aware of... There is this blossoming field of theoretical physics that exists, mind you.
You mean to tell me that we know everything there will ever be known about electricity? About wave patterns? Even at the quantum level? You are kidding yourself, and my original point remains unchanged. The LAW of gravity has been disproven by Einstein through the concept of Time-Space.... You think stereos are so easy because you don't understand even a fraction of a percent about what is truly going on. Think about it for a second, then please explain to me the full potential of possibilities which explain everything we don't know about the sub-particle relationship between electronic plasma fields and conductive elemental materials. The answer may take you infinity +1, because we have yet to explain through any research definitively, and we certainly don't "know" anything about, these sub-particle interactions.
Your focus is one mm in front of your nose; time to zoom out a bit.
You mean to tell me that we know everything there will ever be known about electricity? About wave patterns? Even at the quantum level? You are kidding yourself, and my original point remains unchanged. The LAW of gravity has been disproven by Einstein through the concept of Time-Space.... You think stereos are so easy because you don't understand even a fraction of a percent about what is truly going on. Think about it for a second, then please explain to me the full potential of possibilities which explain everything we don't know about the sub-particle relationship between electronic plasma fields and conductive elemental materials. The answer may take you infinity +1, because we have yet to explain through any research definitively, and we certainly don't "know" anything about, these sub-particle interactions.
Your focus is one mm in front of your nose; time to zoom out a bit.
xx0x0
93
Jul 18, 2018
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SStasNo, there is no such scientific field called audiophile, but there do have some sub field relate to audiophile. Except Psychoacoustics and those fields relate to speakers, researchers have already claimed that there isn't much to do to improve the sound accuracy.
SStas
95
Jul 18, 2018
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xx0x0I think my point is being lost, but let me ask you this: do you not think someday when we understand more about the brain, it might not be clear that some people potentially hear differently than others because they use their brain in slightly different ways?
I honestly don't care one bit about materials used in construction of cables, as long as it sounds the best to me... I do, however, like shiny things though, which probably gets me in trouble a lot, but that is definitely beside the point. :)
I honestly don't care one bit about materials used in construction of cables, as long as it sounds the best to me... I do, however, like shiny things though, which probably gets me in trouble a lot, but that is definitely beside the point. :)
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