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mseaworthy
14
Jan 3, 2017
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rammo
7
Jan 3, 2017
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mseaworthyI've actually been encountering issues of the keyboard 'crashing' after restarting windows (continues to happen until fresh boot). Not sure if your sleep issue is related.
mseasworthy
6
Jan 3, 2017
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rammoA fresh reboot has helped me. I've gone through multiple sleep-wake cycles without an issue now. There is a setting in Windows 10 where you can grant/revoke a keyboard's ability to wake the computer but I think it's "on" by default. Might be worth confirming though.
YanboWu
8490
Collaborations
Jan 4, 2017
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mseaworthyThanks for the great feedback.
We are working on bettering the flow for everything. I'll poke @AndrewLekashman to improve our setup instructions.
We are working on bettering the flow for everything. I'll poke @AndrewLekashman to improve our setup instructions.
AndrewLekashman
2368
Input Club
Jan 4, 2017
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mseaworthy@mseasworthy This is a keyboard kit and there is some assembly required, both in the form of soldering and construction as well as customization and programming. Making proper build instructions and programming guides for these keyboards is definitely something we care quite a bit about at Input Club, but we definitely understand that many people aren't used to having to deal with a set of instructions to type on their keyboard. The current workflow requires a few outside programs be installed, and the step by step guide for how to do this properly on every operating system can be found here -https://input.club/configurator-setup/ . This link is in the Massdrop Buy Page, on our website, and we also link to it in our build guides for the WhiteFox (as well as all our other keyboards!).
It would be better to just download an installer and hit "Go" and have everything work, which is why we have added a new team member who is a world class developer to help with that very task. Setting this magic installer up isn't the easiest thing in the world, especially when it needs to work on so many different operating systems, so we are extensively testing it out right now internally before distributing it. There is no guaranteed release date for the all-in-one installer, so in the meantime, the best course of action is to follow the steps on the link I posted above. If you have any questions, please ask them in the discussion here or check our forum to see if someone else has encountered your issue - https://input.club/forums/forum/support/keyboards/whitefox/
It would be better to just download an installer and hit "Go" and have everything work, which is why we have added a new team member who is a world class developer to help with that very task. Setting this magic installer up isn't the easiest thing in the world, especially when it needs to work on so many different operating systems, so we are extensively testing it out right now internally before distributing it. There is no guaranteed release date for the all-in-one installer, so in the meantime, the best course of action is to follow the steps on the link I posted above. If you have any questions, please ask them in the discussion here or check our forum to see if someone else has encountered your issue - https://input.club/forums/forum/support/keyboards/whitefox/
mseasworthy
6
Jan 4, 2017
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AndrewLekashmanAdding a developer to your staff is probably a good idea, and having a simple one-button install would be nice for a larger audience. But I wasn't pushing the angle of making it more of a "commercial" or "consumer" product and process.
I think the majority of people buy from Massdrop because they miss playing with their Legos. Many of the keyboards you sell can be purchased elsewhere (not so with the WhiteFox), with no fulfillment delays and at similar prices. The appeal here is buying something bespoke...something YOU can build.
Your dedicated, evangelist, repeat buyer is a DIYer and modder who would rather have you put resources into a technical writer and an illustrator / designer. They want to build it themselves but need clear instructions.
I think the majority of people buy from Massdrop because they miss playing with their Legos. Many of the keyboards you sell can be purchased elsewhere (not so with the WhiteFox), with no fulfillment delays and at similar prices. The appeal here is buying something bespoke...something YOU can build.
Your dedicated, evangelist, repeat buyer is a DIYer and modder who would rather have you put resources into a technical writer and an illustrator / designer. They want to build it themselves but need clear instructions.
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Recently completed my build of the WhiteFox. I have mixed feedback, but the majority of it is very favorable. Comical to me that reviews of start with: “and I’m typing on it right now.” Right…you can tell that by…how…curvey my…commas look.
Configuration: Round 2 True Fox layout with Zealio switches.
Design / Layout: Really don’t need to say much here as much has been expressed, and this keyboard has a layout to please anyone welcoming a smallish keyboard. What omissions may be present are remedied by extensive programmability. The design is clearly the result of many iterations and a lot of woodshedding. From packaging, CNC aluminum case, sound-dampening foam, elegant font, superior materials, and color-matched, braided cable, this is the most complete keyboard package I’ve ever seen, and with tighter quality control, it would probably be the highest quality as well.
Web Configurator: Growing accustomed to the details of a workflow makes you appreciate even minute efficiency enhancements. This makes programmability an ante for many (for those boards without programmability, there’s the brilliant USB-to-USB converter offered by Hasu). The Input Club’s web configurator is a very good tool that could become a great tool with sufficient documentation. If you hunt for them, there are a few videos on youtube, but they cover the easier part of programming this board.
The challenging aspect is always getting the right tool chain for your platform so you can flash the board with your configuration. There are no videos for this, and the documentation is incomplete and confusing. This is the only part that really matters. A slick configuration UI is stillborn if you struggle for hours trying to piece together the tools and workflow for getting the custom config to your keyboard.
Seriously. This is a big flaw. Someone went through the work to make a few videos…why make users hunt for them…put them on (or at least a link) the damn page. And a few hours imagining what a user (not an engineer) is going to encounter during the process and how they think. Better yet, pay a technical writer $100 to do it for you to eliminate the gaps and assumptions.
I know many will dispute or minimize this…stop bitching and start googling. Well, that’s what a review is…criticism. Clear documentation is mandatory when you’re selling products requiring assembly. There’s no better way to spur positive word-of-mouth than by surprising your customers with clear, concise (unlike this review, which is a self-absorbed rant) assembly instructions with illustrations. Complete videos even better.
The bar is already low--here put the effort in and you’ll get some grace from buyers when you have a multitude of fulfillment gaffes and delays. Curate all the good-will that users pump into your forums in the way of “this-worked-for-me” posts if nothing else. And a search box does not count as curation.
Manufacturing: I’ve read of some people being shipped PCBs with resistors missing. The quality of the fulfillment makes me suspect of the QA process being thorough (Massdrop’s fulfillment partner needs vetting). People have been shipped incomplete caps sets, incorrectly cut plates and bad stabilizers, but I was shipped a complete set of caps and the PCB is very attractive and well designed.
The quality of the PBT caps are nice, but the legend printing might be below typical Topre quality, and a few caps have rough edges from the molds casting. Not certain, but the spacebar also feels like PBT too…bonus. The Co-star stabilizers seem to be the biggest quality problem…for some reason they rub and catch for many users. All my stabilized keys caught until I reversed them (put the end with the clips for the stab wire facing the top of the keyboard). They are without issue now, but manufacturers often treat stabilizers as two-cent afterthought parts yet they have the sway to make a keyboard a revelation or a doorstop. These stabilizers shouldn’t have gotten through quality checks.
Fulfillment: Massdrop seems to be improving but is still hampered by fulfillment. I can imagine it’s a logistical nightmare to coordinate all those discrete OEMs without a single point of quality assurance. While they frequently miss promoted ship dates, they do offer communication updates close to their stated schedules. Still lots of room to improve.
Assembly: My quality issues are nit picks. I couldn’t get the plate perfectly flush with the top of the case in a few places (where the plate protrudes from the case between the screw mounts about ½ millimeter). My tirade above captures the biggest challenge with assembly: provide clear, detailed, well-illustrated instructions and consumer impressions soar—fail to and frustrations fester.
Sound and feel: My re-introduction into mechanicals was by searching and finding a great layout, small form-factor keyboard with Bluetooth in the Matias Laptop Pro. I say re-introduction as I previously had IBM and Apple mechanical keyboards (yes, I’m posting to a forum way outside my demographic). Like many, I got accustomed to crappy keyboards in the 2000s.
So my “re-introduction” to mechs was via Alps clones. I have a couple Topre keyboards and appreciate the feel and focus to detail offered by Japanese manufacturers. Cherry switches have never tempted me as many of the posts characterized them (and clones as well) as dependent upon extra maintenance to get a quality experience. Thinking about it just now, I do remember having purchased a Filco with Brown switches. I called the distributor asking if there was a fix for the pings. They told me it was common and disassembling and lubing would work. This was a completed board, and the expectation is for the purchasers to complete the build?
I wanted to try something in the Cherry world (with a lower risk of being disappointed) so I opted for the Zealios. I can’t offer a comparison of Zealio to Cherry or Gateron, but this switch feels and sounds great. Obviously, its early days for me with this switch, but it’s every bit as smooth as my Topre/RealForce/PFU keyboards. Longevity and required maintenance could prove to be the buzz kill, but the early experience inspires me to keep an open mind; I didn’t lube any of the switches, but I did lube the Co-star stabilizers. It's a reasonable premise to have to lube them when you buy loose parts or a kit.
It’s an inexperienced observation, but the Cherry stem seem more vulnerable than a Topre slider/barrel. I had one stem break while installing caps. It’s an annoyance having to service a new switch, but it was convenient to get at the guts of the switch while it was still mounted on the plate/PCB. By comparison, I’ve never had a faulty Topre switch, and I’ve had all my boards apart numerous times trying out dampening rings.
Comparative Feel: The feel of the switch maps closest to my RealForce 87U55—I know…blasphemy to the Topre crowd. The travel / throw is a little longer which is desirable, and the rebound is crisp with the steel plate and aluminum case. It’s a crisp apple for your fingers.
The tactile bump is not as pronounced as a Topre switch, but the Zealio has one. I’m a touch typist but not fast (about 80 WPM), and maybe this switches feel good because I’m a masher…not sure though because I have some 35 gram Topres that I favor too. I’m slightly faster and slightly more accurate with this MX clone switch.
I’m having an occasional issue with coming out of Sleep mode in Windows 10. If anyone has experienced similar, please let me know how you’ve resolved this.