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user73
339
Oct 20, 2017
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3KidNerd
175
Oct 20, 2017
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user73You can buy it with or without switches and caps. How is it not a kit? I'm all for Massdrop bashing, but the options are clearly enumerated and very obvious on the join drop page.
user73
339
Oct 20, 2017
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3KidNerdHi - thanks for your comment. I'm not Massdrop-bashing, and I'm not for it, so I'm afraid you're on your own there. I do however reserve the right as a buyer and community member to criticize - constructively, as you may have overlooked - how products are represented in emails and here on the site.
I dislike taking walks similar to this a couple times a week, and I'm confident that I'm not alone:
1) Get an email with a drop announcement for a keyboard kit, clearly depicting switches and keycaps. Very interesting. Click the link to view it.
2) Land on the drop, again showing a completed keyboard. It's $99.00. Cool, I'll take one.
3) Wait a minute. It's $15 for switches and $20 for caps. Another $35 is necessary to get the product depicted in the email and on the drop.
Now, who here breathed a sigh of relief when they saw that they'll have to spend more money to get switches and caps? Hmm? This too closely resembles bait and switch to let slide without a comment.
The better marketing technique would be this: Same email, same product image, same front page, but different price - $134.99. And if I want to, I could choose to pass on the switches and caps altogether, and get just the PCB, case, etc. for $99.00.
Do you see how in the end of those two examples we end up with the same product(s) for the same price, but nevertheless one feels like a good deal while the other feels dishonest? Sticker shock should be a positive experience, not a negative one. And no one should feel like they've been baited into arrangement X, only to have it switched to arrangement Y.
I dislike taking walks similar to this a couple times a week, and I'm confident that I'm not alone:
1) Get an email with a drop announcement for a keyboard kit, clearly depicting switches and keycaps. Very interesting. Click the link to view it.
2) Land on the drop, again showing a completed keyboard. It's $99.00. Cool, I'll take one.
3) Wait a minute. It's $15 for switches and $20 for caps. Another $35 is necessary to get the product depicted in the email and on the drop.
Now, who here breathed a sigh of relief when they saw that they'll have to spend more money to get switches and caps? Hmm? This too closely resembles bait and switch to let slide without a comment.
The better marketing technique would be this: Same email, same product image, same front page, but different price - $134.99. And if I want to, I could choose to pass on the switches and caps altogether, and get just the PCB, case, etc. for $99.00.
Do you see how in the end of those two examples we end up with the same product(s) for the same price, but nevertheless one feels like a good deal while the other feels dishonest? Sticker shock should be a positive experience, not a negative one. And no one should feel like they've been baited into arrangement X, only to have it switched to arrangement Y.
3KidNerd
175
Oct 20, 2017
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user73Oh yes, everyone has the absolute right to criticize. And when you post on a public forum, it can also be critiqued, as you may have overlooked.
Have you ever bought a car? They don't advertise the price of the top model fully loaded. They advertise the base model that no one buys. Heck, they try NOT to tell you the price at all. "We can put you in that car for $439 per month, how's that sound?" This is the same thing. And in this case you stated that this is the Massdrop norm, so you should be conditioned to it.
I do agree that advertising a fully loaded price would be a more upfront approach. But I don't agree it'd be a better marketing technique. In marketing you want to drive demand. The same reason why when they advertise the Mustang it's the "starting at" price for a 4-banger with the GT model shown. The problem Massdrop has is that not everyone wants the fully loaded kit. And so, if they see the $135 price, they may be put off and leave without purchasing. The advertisement in the email doesn't include a price at all, so bait and switch doesn't apply.
Perhaps I'm biased as I don't want a "full" kit as I already have some b-e-a-utiful zealios 67g switches just waiting to be used. And I have a caps ready to go too.
Have you ever bought a car? They don't advertise the price of the top model fully loaded. They advertise the base model that no one buys. Heck, they try NOT to tell you the price at all. "We can put you in that car for $439 per month, how's that sound?" This is the same thing. And in this case you stated that this is the Massdrop norm, so you should be conditioned to it.
I do agree that advertising a fully loaded price would be a more upfront approach. But I don't agree it'd be a better marketing technique. In marketing you want to drive demand. The same reason why when they advertise the Mustang it's the "starting at" price for a 4-banger with the GT model shown. The problem Massdrop has is that not everyone wants the fully loaded kit. And so, if they see the $135 price, they may be put off and leave without purchasing. The advertisement in the email doesn't include a price at all, so bait and switch doesn't apply.
Perhaps I'm biased as I don't want a "full" kit as I already have some b-e-a-utiful zealios 67g switches just waiting to be used. And I have a caps ready to go too.
AverySegaw
78
Oct 20, 2017
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user73It’s always wise to at least read the description before trying to buy anything. Going by a picture alone is foolish. They aren’t trying to trick you as they very clearly state that adding switches and caps can be done at an additional charge.
user73
339
Oct 20, 2017
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3KidNerdCritique away, friend.
I can't agree with the relevancy of your car sales analogy; that's an entirely different and more complicated transaction, and I think your argument teeters on fallacy when you liken it to the subject of my comments - especially when no one here needs to discuss auto sales to understand keyboard purchasing. We're all well versed in the latter.
I also disagree with any rationale suggesting that I, indeed anyone in the community, should be conditioned to the sort of gotcha pricing that I'm pointing out. To claim otherwise would very much resemble blaming the victim; as though I'm the one in the wrong for speaking up against price obfuscation? No sir.
I do agree with your admission of possible bias though. I think it's much easier for you to blame me for my expectations, than it is for you to put yourself in my position and consider my comments as someone who does want a "full" kit and who, upon seeing a complete keyboard next to $99, expects a complete keyboard for $99.
I'm not asking for anything radical or unheard of, and my suggestions echo the fundamentals of marketing and retail merchandising. And while I appreciate you jumping in to discuss this with me, I don't understand what it is you believe you're arguing for, or what you believe you're contributing to this discourse... other than just to be argumentative for the hell of it. *shrug* Whatever the case, I'll leave you to it. Thanks for sharing.
I can't agree with the relevancy of your car sales analogy; that's an entirely different and more complicated transaction, and I think your argument teeters on fallacy when you liken it to the subject of my comments - especially when no one here needs to discuss auto sales to understand keyboard purchasing. We're all well versed in the latter.
I also disagree with any rationale suggesting that I, indeed anyone in the community, should be conditioned to the sort of gotcha pricing that I'm pointing out. To claim otherwise would very much resemble blaming the victim; as though I'm the one in the wrong for speaking up against price obfuscation? No sir.
I do agree with your admission of possible bias though. I think it's much easier for you to blame me for my expectations, than it is for you to put yourself in my position and consider my comments as someone who does want a "full" kit and who, upon seeing a complete keyboard next to $99, expects a complete keyboard for $99.
I'm not asking for anything radical or unheard of, and my suggestions echo the fundamentals of marketing and retail merchandising. And while I appreciate you jumping in to discuss this with me, I don't understand what it is you believe you're arguing for, or what you believe you're contributing to this discourse... other than just to be argumentative for the hell of it. *shrug* Whatever the case, I'll leave you to it. Thanks for sharing.
user73
339
Oct 20, 2017
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AverySegawHi - thanks for the comment, but you're blaming the victim.
There's no description on the email newsletters, and no reason to think that the product - should you choose to click on it - is going to be something other than what's pictured right there in the email. If you're psychic, sure maybe you could infer that, but everyone else is within reason to expect what's pictured. This, combined with the on-site switch to different pricing, is what I take issue with - the two, collectively.
Again, product descriptions aren't the issue nor are they relevant to the discussion. We all see the product description, but only after we're led to believe that the product is something else.
To all: I hope you can follow my argument and understand my reason for raising these issues, because I don't wish to belabor the point of that argument by continually breaking it down into smaller bites for everyone who wants to chime in. Sorry. It's tiring and I just straight up have other shit to do. Good luck all.
There's no description on the email newsletters, and no reason to think that the product - should you choose to click on it - is going to be something other than what's pictured right there in the email. If you're psychic, sure maybe you could infer that, but everyone else is within reason to expect what's pictured. This, combined with the on-site switch to different pricing, is what I take issue with - the two, collectively.
Again, product descriptions aren't the issue nor are they relevant to the discussion. We all see the product description, but only after we're led to believe that the product is something else.
To all: I hope you can follow my argument and understand my reason for raising these issues, because I don't wish to belabor the point of that argument by continually breaking it down into smaller bites for everyone who wants to chime in. Sorry. It's tiring and I just straight up have other shit to do. Good luck all.
3KidNerd
175
Oct 20, 2017
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user73You're funny. "Price obfuscation?" If you're so upset, then vote with your dollars. It's been pointed out in this discussion (not this particular thread, but this discussion) that the exact same product is available on other sites for about the same price. And while in this case I'm opting for the set without the extras, there are other cases where I want all the things. My bias applies on both sides, but at least I'm willing to recognize it. How about keycap sets? How should Massdrop market the price on those sets? Is this relevant enough for you? Should I see the price and say, YES, that's the price for the exact keyboard I own! Or should I have to realize that I have unique needs (1.75u r-shift) and that I'll need to buy a add-on kit for it?
Victim blaming? You're a victim? Of what? Using a site you're not forced to use? They have very few Massdrop exclusives and this isn't one of them.
Fundamentally, I stand by the fact that the product is exactly as stated/shown.
Victim blaming? You're a victim? Of what? Using a site you're not forced to use? They have very few Massdrop exclusives and this isn't one of them.
Fundamentally, I stand by the fact that the product is exactly as stated/shown.
AverySegaw
78
Oct 20, 2017
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user73I’m not blaming the victim because there’s no crime. Reading comprehension is a thing. Common sense is a thing. Smart buying practices are a thing. If you think that anything up for sale should be taken at face value based on a single photo and that you shouldn’t need to (Lord forbid) read the description to understand exactly what it is you are buying, then you should likely remove yourself from any and all online retail marketplaces.
LMAONAISE
147
Oct 21, 2017
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user73I've learned to immediately click 'join drop' to get right to the pudding on here, too many surprises (price wise).
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If a keyboard doesn't include switches and keycaps, then please don't use photos like this to depict the product. Doing so only presents an opportunity for shoppers to misunderstand what they're buying. If you show us a keyboard kit that doesn't come with switches or keycaps, I assure you we can handle the task of imagining what it would look like with switches and keycaps. I just had a pointless 30-minute chat with a friend about buying this kit, which ended disappointingly when we read into the details.
Additionally, it's not really a Mechanical Keyboard Kit if the mechanical components aren't included - it's a PCB and Case Kit.
A better job can be done of presenting all of this to us, do you not agree? Thank you, and keep up the good work. :)