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m4t3y
3
Dec 12, 2017
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beaucauchemar
41
Dec 28, 2017
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m4t3yI'm very curious to hear some comparison notes as I currently have the Ori non-perf lambskins on my 4XX (with other mods) but am still tempted to see if the perf or suede perform even better overall. Please post your findings when you can.
m4t3y
3
Dec 28, 2017
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beaucauchemarI will post which I liked the most, but more then a month before they start shipping them ;o[
I received my 4xx just yesterday and after initial listening I think the lambskin non-perforated might be the best fit. Compared to my HD558 (with no foams inside - aka the 598 mod) the 4xx kinda lack bass punch and treble. Tbh I was hoping for a much better bass from what I've read. But it might change a bit after burn-in, will see. Still as of now I think the non-perforated ones would get me most in a direction where I feel they are lacking now. I am running them on Pioneer U-05 so power should not be an issue. So far the only areas where they beat my senns is separation and clarity. In all other areas (comfort, soundstage, bass, treble they are little behind). Overall I like the sound of sennheiser more, but maybe after burn-in and some mods my preference might swing to 4xx.
Out of curiosity what other mods did you do except pad rolling? I got some foam pad discs I found on aliexpress, probably not gonna change much but they were just few bucks shipped. Compared to stock they probably will just suppress some freq so I might not need that as I don't feel any treble fatigue with them. Also got a balanced cable, but other then that I don't know what else I could do to improve them.
I might also grab the ZMF headband pad, but will wait until my pads arrive. The 4xx are just a slightly too large for my head even on smallest setting for a perfect positioning, but maybe the thicker zmf pads will sort it out as it's just by a little bit.
I received my 4xx just yesterday and after initial listening I think the lambskin non-perforated might be the best fit. Compared to my HD558 (with no foams inside - aka the 598 mod) the 4xx kinda lack bass punch and treble. Tbh I was hoping for a much better bass from what I've read. But it might change a bit after burn-in, will see. Still as of now I think the non-perforated ones would get me most in a direction where I feel they are lacking now. I am running them on Pioneer U-05 so power should not be an issue. So far the only areas where they beat my senns is separation and clarity. In all other areas (comfort, soundstage, bass, treble they are little behind). Overall I like the sound of sennheiser more, but maybe after burn-in and some mods my preference might swing to 4xx.
Out of curiosity what other mods did you do except pad rolling? I got some foam pad discs I found on aliexpress, probably not gonna change much but they were just few bucks shipped. Compared to stock they probably will just suppress some freq so I might not need that as I don't feel any treble fatigue with them. Also got a balanced cable, but other then that I don't know what else I could do to improve them.
I might also grab the ZMF headband pad, but will wait until my pads arrive. The 4xx are just a slightly too large for my head even on smallest setting for a perfect positioning, but maybe the thicker zmf pads will sort it out as it's just by a little bit.
beaucauchemar
41
Dec 28, 2017
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m4t3yInterestingly enough I have the same problem in that the smallest setting was still a tad too big with the stock Focus A pads. They were perfectly fine on the smallest setting in my case after putting on the Ori lambskins. A pilot pad would definitely help although I don't feel like it'll be necessary on mine. The hair roller mod improved things even further in that I was able to start using some of the adjustable length and not have them slammed to their shortest setting. Let me explain...
My current mods: ZMF Ori non-perforated pads + grill mod (popular Hifiman mod, instructions from Jerg on headfi) + foam hair roller mod. The last one is a much more recently concocted mod which I read about somewhere within the recent pages of the headfi post dedicated to the 4XX. It involves placing these...
At this point, I'll be most interested in hearing how the suede Ori's compare to the non-perf and perf lambskins.
My current mods: ZMF Ori non-perforated pads + grill mod (popular Hifiman mod, instructions from Jerg on headfi) + foam hair roller mod. The last one is a much more recently concocted mod which I read about somewhere within the recent pages of the headfi post dedicated to the 4XX. It involves placing these...
At this point, I'll be most interested in hearing how the suede Ori's compare to the non-perf and perf lambskins.
Surenintendo
1
Jan 11, 2018
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beaucauchemarInteresting read! I too ordered the perforated oris for my he400i because I wanted to keep the same airiness/openess as the focus pads (I read somewhere that the non-perforated does block out more sound). According to Rtings, openess plays a big role in sound stage too.
After reading your impressions, I'm crossing my fingers and hoping it sounds good and not too bass anemic >.<
After reading your impressions, I'm crossing my fingers and hoping it sounds good and not too bass anemic >.<
beaucauchemar
41
Jan 11, 2018
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Surenintendo
Spent quite a bit of time pad rolling and comparing the non-perforated Ori to the perforated Ori last night (both with the foam insert mod) using the same set of tracks at the same volume to see which was truly superior. In stock form with a couple of hours playtime, they sounded good, but not great pretty much across the board, which is why I got modding immediately. It's worth noting, as I outlined in a previous thread, that these 4XXs also have the grill mod using paper tray mesh and no dust screen along with having over 170 hours worth of play time. They also are using a custom silver-plated 22-gauge OFC cable from Amplifier Surgery. Equipment used in this comparison: straight from my XDP-100R playing the first few tracks from Steve Turre's Woody's Delight (mainly for balance, imaging, sibilance testing) and various tracks from Tame Impala's Currents (mainly for balance and soundstage testing). Updated Ratings after Ori pad comparison: 4XX (non-perforated Ori + grill mod + foam pad mod): treble 0 / mids -1 / lows +1 / soundstage -1.5 / imaging -1 / detail -1 4XX (perforated Ori + grill mod + foam pad mod): treble +0.25 / mids 0 / lows 0 / soundstage -0.5 / imaging 0 / detail -0.5 I started this comparison because I started feeling as though the perforated pads introduced a touch more treble tipping it into the warning zone for near-harshness. After the comparison though I came to the realization that the recording and volume must have influenced this thinking, as switching back to the non-perforated pads (neutral-dark) they exhibited an almost indistinguishable difference in harshness (which is to say very minimal, again depending on the recording.) The highest brass notes on Woody's Delight inspired only a single wince or two and when it happened it felt appropriate for the recording's intent and intensity. In this back and forth though I did notice that the non-perforated pads seemed a bit congested which I hadn't noticed without comparing and switching over to the perforated pads the sound opened up with more air/space and better imaging. Jazz recordings can get busy sounding and the perforated pads handled this with ease. The swirling synths on Current's showed the perforated pads to have improved the soundstage to very satisfying levels. Since I felt that bass was too anemic without the foam pad mod (and previously the hair roller mod), but also slightly too prominent with the foam pad mod and the non-perforated Ori, I was happy to realize that the perforated pads tamed the bass ever so slightly so that a perfect Goldilocks amount of bass tightness/impact/detail/amount was achieved. The juicy distorted synth groove on the tail end of Tame Impala's Let It Happen sent a chill down my body and the upright bass on Woody's Delight had just enough heft and body to seem very real. To briefly explain, the foam (pads or rollers) was used to distance the driver farther from the ears which made a noticeable increase in all things bass and are fit in the ring pocket between the Ori's foam and mounting ring. For a frame of reference, my bass port modded Q701s seem to be putting out a similar bass amount (although slightly more body not being as neutral) with the 4XX+Perforated Ori+foam pad mod pulling ahead of the Q701's low end in terms of response, detail, impact, and sub bass. In going back and forth I also realized just how much more I prefer the modded 4XX over my previously loved Q701s. The soundstage on the AKGs by comparison now makes them seem almost unnatural and odd while the perforated pads and grill mod brought the 4XX to a natural, pleasing soundstage somewhere between the Elear and HD800. Imaging is also quite good and I can easily tell where instruments are in the space. In terms of neutrality, I feel as though the perforated pads improved even further on the non-perforated Ori and am now able to easily focus on whatever instrument I want in the mix without it getting lost or overshadowed. Superb balance indeed. It's worth mentioning that since my previous cans were the Q701, your mileage may vary in terms of treble on this series of 4XX mods although I should say that it is less strident and smoother than the AKGs while never feeling even slightly veiled or losing detail/microdetail. If you can't tell already, I am loving the 4XXs with this combo of mods and feel as though this might be it for new cans for a while given my high level of satisfaction at this point. Even off of the DAP I was getting goosebumps at the sheer amount of pleasure and technical prowess these things were putting out. There was also a bit of disbelief given how relatively cheap these things were even with the mods ($325 total). So if you have the 4XXs, do yourself a favor and make the same changes. I'm sure you'll be quite impressed as well.
Spent quite a bit of time pad rolling and comparing the non-perforated Ori to the perforated Ori last night (both with the foam insert mod) using the same set of tracks at the same volume to see which was truly superior. In stock form with a couple of hours playtime, they sounded good, but not great pretty much across the board, which is why I got modding immediately. It's worth noting, as I outlined in a previous thread, that these 4XXs also have the grill mod using paper tray mesh and no dust screen along with having over 170 hours worth of play time. They also are using a custom silver-plated 22-gauge OFC cable from Amplifier Surgery. Equipment used in this comparison: straight from my XDP-100R playing the first few tracks from Steve Turre's Woody's Delight (mainly for balance, imaging, sibilance testing) and various tracks from Tame Impala's Currents (mainly for balance and soundstage testing). Updated Ratings after Ori pad comparison: 4XX (non-perforated Ori + grill mod + foam pad mod): treble 0 / mids -1 / lows +1 / soundstage -1.5 / imaging -1 / detail -1 4XX (perforated Ori + grill mod + foam pad mod): treble +0.25 / mids 0 / lows 0 / soundstage -0.5 / imaging 0 / detail -0.5 I started this comparison because I started feeling as though the perforated pads introduced a touch more treble tipping it into the warning zone for near-harshness. After the comparison though I came to the realization that the recording and volume must have influenced this thinking, as switching back to the non-perforated pads (neutral-dark) they exhibited an almost indistinguishable difference in harshness (which is to say very minimal, again depending on the recording.) The highest brass notes on Woody's Delight inspired only a single wince or two and when it happened it felt appropriate for the recording's intent and intensity. In this back and forth though I did notice that the non-perforated pads seemed a bit congested which I hadn't noticed without comparing and switching over to the perforated pads the sound opened up with more air/space and better imaging. Jazz recordings can get busy sounding and the perforated pads handled this with ease. The swirling synths on Current's showed the perforated pads to have improved the soundstage to very satisfying levels. Since I felt that bass was too anemic without the foam pad mod (and previously the hair roller mod), but also slightly too prominent with the foam pad mod and the non-perforated Ori, I was happy to realize that the perforated pads tamed the bass ever so slightly so that a perfect Goldilocks amount of bass tightness/impact/detail/amount was achieved. The juicy distorted synth groove on the tail end of Tame Impala's Let It Happen sent a chill down my body and the upright bass on Woody's Delight had just enough heft and body to seem very real. To briefly explain, the foam (pads or rollers) was used to distance the driver farther from the ears which made a noticeable increase in all things bass and are fit in the ring pocket between the Ori's foam and mounting ring. For a frame of reference, my bass port modded Q701s seem to be putting out a similar bass amount (although slightly more body not being as neutral) with the 4XX+Perforated Ori+foam pad mod pulling ahead of the Q701's low end in terms of response, detail, impact, and sub bass. In going back and forth I also realized just how much more I prefer the modded 4XX over my previously loved Q701s. The soundstage on the AKGs by comparison now makes them seem almost unnatural and odd while the perforated pads and grill mod brought the 4XX to a natural, pleasing soundstage somewhere between the Elear and HD800. Imaging is also quite good and I can easily tell where instruments are in the space. In terms of neutrality, I feel as though the perforated pads improved even further on the non-perforated Ori and am now able to easily focus on whatever instrument I want in the mix without it getting lost or overshadowed. Superb balance indeed. It's worth mentioning that since my previous cans were the Q701, your mileage may vary in terms of treble on this series of 4XX mods although I should say that it is less strident and smoother than the AKGs while never feeling even slightly veiled or losing detail/microdetail. If you can't tell already, I am loving the 4XXs with this combo of mods and feel as though this might be it for new cans for a while given my high level of satisfaction at this point. Even off of the DAP I was getting goosebumps at the sheer amount of pleasure and technical prowess these things were putting out. There was also a bit of disbelief given how relatively cheap these things were even with the mods ($325 total). So if you have the 4XXs, do yourself a favor and make the same changes. I'm sure you'll be quite impressed as well.
Surenintendo
1
Jan 11, 2018
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beaucauchemarOmg I'm just salivating from reading this! Thank you for the insightful and detailed review. Not many people have the perforated pads, so I think the folks at headfi would love to hear your impressions if you haven't already posted there, heh :)
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seems stupid to spend almost as much on pads as the cans itself but since I am also buying a new dac/pre-amp for them (and my PreSonus Sceptre S8) I can justify spending a little more. Ordered a Pioneer U-05, hope it will be a good match, not many options under 1000 when I want balanced XLR4 phone out and variable pre-amp with balanced XLR3 outs for my speakers.
also got a nice balanced XLR cable for the 4xx, some 2mm and 4mm foam pad discs off aliexpress, hifiman rings from audiophonics.fr and a nice new XLR cables for the speakers since I am using balanced TRRS cables now