ZPacks 20° Down Sleeping Bagsearch

ZPacks 20° Down Sleeping Bag

ZPacks 20° Down Sleeping Bag

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So all of two or three people joined this drop - Ouch!
This typeo of "deal" is gonna cause a Mass Drop out of users to this site.
Shipping cost is surprising. Zpacks always uses priority mail. I also have this bag but have switched to Enlightened Equipment since. ( last order: Type DownTek Treated: 850, Temperature: 0°F (-17°C), Length: XLong - 7', Width: XWide - 64", Outside Fabric Forest 10D, Inside Fabric Color: Black 10D, Optional 20D Weather Resistant Stripes: Black 20D) for $385
DWebber
There's a drop for a 20º F Enlightened Equipment quilt starting on Friday, October 13 for $220: https://www.massdrop.com/buy/massdrop-x-enlightened-equipment-revelation-quilt
Uggh, the $34.63 for shipping and tax totally nullifies whatever bit of savings there would have been for me.
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Or buy a EE quilt instead!
Sloper
Or Underground Quilts!
Florida residents save $39.79 on a "standard girth - long - green" by avoiding state sales tax.
$365.74 here. $405.53 on zpacks(dot)com.

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As Joomy noted - please correct the weights, Massdrop. The quilts are significantly heavier than specified here (based on the Zpacks website). Thank you.
I just needed to throw my two cents in. I almost laughed out loud when I saw the price on this. A 6% discount? I thought the whole point of Massdrop was to get a lower price for its members by placing bulk orders. If this is the best you can get from Zpacks for a discount then maybe you should be looking some where else for sleeping bags/quilts.
vikesguy62
Agreed. I have a ZPacks Twin quilt that I use when I need the twin. My other quilts are EE. With such a small discount, buying direct provides greater support for a great small company by cutting out the middleman (Massdrop in this case.) I don't need another but, if I did, I would skip this one and buy direct even if it costs a bit more.
If the drop for their sleeping bag is this price, I don't have much hope with much price savings if a Zpacks backpack or tent ever makes its way onto this site.
CheerioCoil
The zpacks tents have come around a few times, they're currently out of my budget so I'm not sure if they were much of a deal or not.
The weights are wrong for the standard and broad widths. They are for the 2C bag rather than the -7C bag. http://www.zpacks.com/quilts/sleepingbag.shtml
This is the worst "deal" I've ever seen. I wanted a slim/long. It's $353. On their website it's $359. Total BS.
I have one ready and it worked great for my AT thru; thinking about getting one for the lady...
This looks like a cool bag but I am a little hung up on the lack of hood. Not only for warmth: my hood is what holds my pillow in place. Does anyone have experience with a bag like this?
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TeenageMutantNinjaSquirtle
I have their 20 degree bag. I use the Neemo Filo pillow (it's heavy, but I sleep so much better with it) and a really old but awesome Therm-a-rest lite pad. I don't have a problem with my pillow. I also took a Sea to Summit UL pillow with me on two trips and had no problems with it (But didn't like the way it slept). I used to use a mummy bag and thought that the hood helped keep the pillow in place but found that it wasn't an issue.
Somebody else mentioned that the Zpacks' ratings were generous, but I think 20 degrees is what mainstream bags refer to as the EN Lower Limit and the EN Comfort Limit is closer to 30 degrees. This is normal in mainstream bags and isn't an issue or an attempt at Zpacks to dissemble.
The loft on my 20 degree bag is incredible. The bag itself (Standard length/width) is also lighter than my EE 40 degree quilt I believe. However, at 20 (or even 30) degrees, you need a minimum of a skull cap or better yet, a balaclava, to be comfortable. The standard width is fairly snug, which I didn't like at first but it didn't bother me after my first couple of trips. I do sleep with lightweight thermals if I expect colder weather.
Really, aside from the closed foot box, the Zpacks bag isn't all that much different than a quilt, except that it is more expensive but lighter. My 20 degree Zpacks bag is lighter than my 40 degree EE quilt, even though the quilt has less materials being a quilt.
TeenageMutantNinjaSquirtle
I have a down quilt without a hood and I have found that the lack of a hood is not an issue. I have the Klymit X Pillow (that I bought off massdrop) and it does not move around that much during the night. This might be different for you depending on your pillow though.
7% savings, then you pay shipping= no savings . Hmmm.
What's the advantage of vertical baffles?
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What does 'a little on the cool side' mean? Are you saying that their bag isn't as warm as they say?
dday1937
Yes. You have to take people's claims with a grain of salt sometimes, especially as quilts have become the new norm and everyone starts buying them. Many people expect them to be like a bag and don't realize that they are warmth-rated a bit differently, plus everyone's personal thermostat isn't the same. There seems to be consistent feedback that Zpacks' and Enlightened Equipment's are not quite as warm as the temp ratings given to them. Hear less of that from companies like Hammock Gear, UGQ, Nunatak, Katabatic, etc. That is mostly owing to each of them using more down per similar temp rating.
wow, less than 10$ off after you pay shipping, horrible deal
When selecting down sleeping bags and quilts, it is wise to consider the materials and how it is used within what system it is used in. The colder the temperatures and the more humidity in the environment, the more likely there will be condensations challenges within the quilt/bag. The accumulation of moisture in a down bag equates to greater drying times or a loss of loft and thus a loss of heat retention. For these times, it is wise to have a shell fabric that is more air permeable with a good DWR. For reference: https://hikelighter.com/2015/02/18/wind-jackets-montbell-tachyon-patagonia-houdini-zpacks-wind-shell/: https://backpackinglight.com/forums/topic/100458/ .53 CFM — ZPacks Pertex GL .53 CFM — ZPacks Ventrum ( ZPacks claims it is equivalent to the Pertex GL) Joe V at Zpacks reports Ventrum was tested at 6.63 CFM with a HH of 281 mm. Here are the details for UL Argon not be confused with the sil treated Argon. 40.1 CFM - Argon 90 48.9 CFM - Argon 67 Considering that the most air permeable true rain garment is .5 CFM (Neoshell Membrane)... As a rule, the greater the CFM, the less moisture will accumulate in the down for conditions that are ripe for condensation (cold and foggy). Moisture accumulation in insulation, is more common, the colder the air temperature. Researching dew point may be helpful when selecting a quilt/bag as it relates to the materials and their characteristics .
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You have the right idea although I can not say that Ventrum would accumulate a lot more moisture as there are other variables. The higher the CFM for these types of fabrics, the higher the rate of vapor transfer. Keep in mind these numbers are relative and that there are other variables like relative humidity and dew point. According to Joe V at Zpacks, the CFM was tested at over 6 CFM so there is a bit of discrepancy in the reported air permeability. When choosing a sleeping bag or bivy, the more you understand the environmental challenges of the trip and your shelter, the better chances you have of minimizing moisture accumulation over time. With down, you are always wise to place your down garment in the sun to allow any accumulated moisture to evaporate. I am guessing that Ventrum would be best suited for lower humidity environment and temperatures above 20 oF. Always strive to maximize air flow in your shelter, this will help a lot with moisture management. Not to confuse matters but, I have had zero air permeability fabrics but with high "breathability" (MVTR) and these bags failed miserably in terms of moisture management, in damp and cold environments. These types of materials move moisture based on a pressure differential and that pressure differential depends in part on the temperature on both sides of membrane. That is all well and good but if you have more insulation, that pressure differential will be less and thus you have a recipe for moisture accumulation.
MasterRo
OK, quite a bit of confusion going around here as usual.
First, it's Ventum not "Ventrum".
Second, Richard Nisley tested Ventum at 6.6 CFM: https://backpackinglight.com/forums/topic/100720/#post-3495273. His measurements are usually taken to be reliable so I'm not sure where the confusion is coming from? Is there some other claimed measured CFM for this fabric?
Third, non-air-permeable membranes do *not* rely on pressure differentials. If there were a pressure differential your jacket or sleeping bag would puff up around you like a balloon. They rely on humidity differential. If it's humid outside your jacket/bag then they will work less well than if it's very dry outside.
Finally, since air-permeable fabrics rely on air-movement if you are inside a relatively still tent the fact that they are air-permeable is not going to matter much. Most of the moisture exchange is going to be due to the humidity differential.
People have long used bivy bags and sleeping bags shells made out of eVent and similar fabrics with FAR lower air-permeability than Ventum. Western Mountaineering use Windstopper on their higher-end sleeping bags which is not at all air-permeable. There is no reason to think that you need a high air-permeability fabric on a sleeping bag in most situations.
Of course more breathability is nice but if the climate is already very humid then no fabric is going to "breathe" very well, since there is nowhere for the excess moisture in your bag to go. If the climate is fairly dry (or even moderately dry) then all fabrics will breathe better and anything with higher breathability than Gore-Tex is going to be just fine. This is of course conditional on you being able to regulate your temperature reasonably well. If you are really overheating nothing will prevent from waking up soaked in sweat. Also, more breathability means less water-resistance.
So if I'm 6'5" the extra long won't fit?
wow 20 dollars off! Great!
I have 2 of their bags. A single for me and a dual for me and my girlfriend.
Also own their zero pack that has custom pocket to fit their tent in one side pocket.
Ultralight set up. 8lbs base weight.
Outstanding gear.
If this was a 0 degree I'd be in.
All of the orders have been shipped and are now on the way to you! Once tracking is available, you will receive a confirmation email with tracking information. Please allow 24-48 hours for this information to update in the courier’s system.
If you have any questions, please visit our Help Center (http://massdrop.com/helpcenter).
We're also on Instagram! We'd love to see photos of the drops you've received. Give us a follow @Massdrop and tag your pictures #massdrop. https://instagram.com/massdrop
Just about there! We've been in touch with the vendor regarding the group's order and they've let us know that they are still working to gather and package the group's order for individual shipment to each of you. We will continue to check in with them throughout the fulfillment process and update the group again as soon as everything is sent out!
Expect another update from us on 8/3 or sooner if something comes up.
If you have any questions, please visit our Help Center (https://massdrop.com/helpcenter).
Just about there! Our vendor has informed us that the ZPacks 20° Down Sleeping Bag will be available to them by beginning of August. They will be working hard to prepare this order for shipment for the group. We are currently still on track for everything to be shipped by the estimated ship date.
Expect another update from us on 7/28 or sooner if something comes up.
If you have any questions, please visit our Help Center (https://massdrop.com/helpcenter).
Thanks again for joining this drop! We have submitted the group's order with the vendor for the ZPacks 20° Down Sleeping Bag and they are working hard to prepare it for shipment.
As soon as the group's order is ready at the vendor's location, they will ship the individual orders directly to you. The current estimated ship date is 8/3.
We will keep the group updated throughout the fulfillment process. You can expect an update from us by the end of the day Pacific Time on 7/22.
If you have any questions, please visit our Help Center (http://massdrop.com/helpcenter).
I would just buy from HammockGear and get a quilt. I own 3 of them. 10d fabric and as light as you could want.
only worth it if you're not thinking ahead... like getting an extra long/extra wide to store stuff you dont want to freeze for ya know... when the temp gets close to the bag's rating, 20! haha wish it was more of a discount! only good thing i see here is the fast ship date!
You save less than 10% after you pay postage. Zpacks has free shipping so what's up with the shipping cost?
Hiker64
Agreed. Zpacks is a good company but I'm not sure why these drops are here. Very little group savings. Also, the down isn't even hydro-phobic.
A little bit pricey for a bag but At just a little over a pound for a wide/medium, it will be worth it when doing a thru hike.
Scoob
Non-water resistant down too.
I literally just purchased a green 20F Wide/Long direct from ZPacks.
What would be the price of the 20F Wide/Long bag? through this drop?
Got it, thank you. I just checked it out and for me it would come out to $416.24, so I'd be saving about $20 USD, compared to direct from ZPacks. I'm thinking that with the dollar conversion, and the tax that I'll have to pay once it get's into Canada, it'll probably end up being about the same as just buying it direct from ZPacks along with the other items I purchased from them.
Does this have DownTek/Dri-Power down?
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Well, I guess they don't treat their down. Going with a EE Revelation :)
scottman187
It should be noted that there has been a movement *away* from chemical treated animal down over the last few years, including by those companies who lead the way in its development.
is it returnable if you decide it isn't right for some reason? can you get it with a full zipper?