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aikilink
124
Sep 14, 2017
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A community member
Sep 14, 2017
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aikilinkI've asked for a complete refund on the Godspeed XDA and it was granted in less than 5 minutes. Let's show Massdrop that the community will not tolerate this kind of predatory behavior through the only way they can really feel: on their wallets. And if Massdrop doesn't refund people, time to talk with PayPal and/or your credit card company.
A community member
Sep 14, 2017
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aikilinkThere is a very nice tutorial on DIY dye-subbing keycaps on reddit: https://www.reddit.com/r/MechanicalKeyboards/comments/6egoot/idea23_how_to_dye_sub_your_own_caps/ and a post there where someone followed the tutorial: https://www.reddit.com/r/MechanicalKeyboards/comments/6w57wt/custom_diy_dyesubbed_xda_mechmini/
livingspeedbump
6723
KeyChatter’s Owner and Editor-in-Chief
Sep 16, 2017
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aikilinkI can't help but feel like you have this slightly backwards.
The keyboard community wasn't always a "big hit" for Massdrop, or even one of the biggest communities. We were a huge risk. Years ago there were only small individuals/groups running group buys and PMK had a few group buys in their store. The community was FAR smaller than it is now. For example, 1976 originally ran on the PMK store and barely hit the 100 buyers needed to be produced. My set Jukebox was the first SA set to ever run on MD, and it was just under 250 total kits sold (base kit+all over kits. It was a small buy!). MD really helped provide an option for the community to run buys through that had more accountability and was safer than some community buys, that had/have always had issues here and there. MD fronted the risk of the buy and provided a very safe platform to buy from (getting a refund from MD is not hard if there are issues, they often provide refunds when community buys never would).
The reason why the IC club stuff did so well on MD was greatly in part due to all the little buys they took risks on and made very little on the previous years. It took quite a while for MD to become what it is today for Mech Keys, and it was a lot of hard work. I watched it happen.
In this case MD acted like a parent company. They invested piles of money to prototype and create a product. They handled shipping logistics. They handled packaging. They did a whole lot that would have been extremely hard for IC to do on their own, and at the very least much quicker than they could have on their own had they just used Kickstarter from the start.
To me, from a business perspective, I can't understand the confusion here. It seems like common sense that MD would own the products they invested in. This is just how business works. It's a shame people can't see this and are so quick to call "foul" just because they are a "big company." The only "foul" I'd call here is for bringing this out in public, when it should have been handled behind closed doors through friendly talks like adults. This isn't "the communities" business. The community didn't have anything to do with this part of things.
The keyboard community wasn't always a "big hit" for Massdrop, or even one of the biggest communities. We were a huge risk. Years ago there were only small individuals/groups running group buys and PMK had a few group buys in their store. The community was FAR smaller than it is now. For example, 1976 originally ran on the PMK store and barely hit the 100 buyers needed to be produced. My set Jukebox was the first SA set to ever run on MD, and it was just under 250 total kits sold (base kit+all over kits. It was a small buy!). MD really helped provide an option for the community to run buys through that had more accountability and was safer than some community buys, that had/have always had issues here and there. MD fronted the risk of the buy and provided a very safe platform to buy from (getting a refund from MD is not hard if there are issues, they often provide refunds when community buys never would).
The reason why the IC club stuff did so well on MD was greatly in part due to all the little buys they took risks on and made very little on the previous years. It took quite a while for MD to become what it is today for Mech Keys, and it was a lot of hard work. I watched it happen.
In this case MD acted like a parent company. They invested piles of money to prototype and create a product. They handled shipping logistics. They handled packaging. They did a whole lot that would have been extremely hard for IC to do on their own, and at the very least much quicker than they could have on their own had they just used Kickstarter from the start.
To me, from a business perspective, I can't understand the confusion here. It seems like common sense that MD would own the products they invested in. This is just how business works. It's a shame people can't see this and are so quick to call "foul" just because they are a "big company." The only "foul" I'd call here is for bringing this out in public, when it should have been handled behind closed doors through friendly talks like adults. This isn't "the communities" business. The community didn't have anything to do with this part of things.
aikilink
124
Sep 16, 2017
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livingspeedbumpI am well aware that the MK community is growing only more recently, and that it started off small. I've seen a lot of GBs get cancelled, shut down, or just not get enough interest. I wasn't even hinting that it started off as a big money thing. My point was that IC, with their Ergodox runs were a big part of the MK part of MD becoming successful. Of course, it's due to the community that MD was able to attract, and the many other makers too, but IC was a big part of that.
When I say the MK community brought MD a lot of money, I don't mean that we just walked in and gave it to them. There were risks, to be sure, but where we are today, we've benefited MD financially quite a bit, right? In turn, they helped a lot of makers and buyers get things that wouldn't have been likely to happen.
To be fair here, IC isn't something that I have any feelings about. I think they are doing good things, and having MD fund there projects makes sense. It also makes sense that MD should have exclusive rights. I don't approve of this drama either, but I think what is happening is wrong on MD's part. I also think IC is being pretty petty/immature, but in the end, it's a lose-lose.
The confusion here is pretty obvious to a lot of us. There are two stories, and obviously, each party is only responding in a way that sheds positive light on them. I agree, this could have all been taken care of quietly, but that didn't happen. At this point, both parties had to inform their customers of potential changes. IC's kickstarter needs new switches, and that needed to at least be clarified. Again though, everything has been done poorly.
There is a big difference in something being legally possible/doable, and making a morally poor choice and exploiting those potential loopholes. That is what people aren't sure about. Sure, it was within MD's right, seemingly, but does that mean it is 'right'?
When I say the MK community brought MD a lot of money, I don't mean that we just walked in and gave it to them. There were risks, to be sure, but where we are today, we've benefited MD financially quite a bit, right? In turn, they helped a lot of makers and buyers get things that wouldn't have been likely to happen.
To be fair here, IC isn't something that I have any feelings about. I think they are doing good things, and having MD fund there projects makes sense. It also makes sense that MD should have exclusive rights. I don't approve of this drama either, but I think what is happening is wrong on MD's part. I also think IC is being pretty petty/immature, but in the end, it's a lose-lose.
The confusion here is pretty obvious to a lot of us. There are two stories, and obviously, each party is only responding in a way that sheds positive light on them. I agree, this could have all been taken care of quietly, but that didn't happen. At this point, both parties had to inform their customers of potential changes. IC's kickstarter needs new switches, and that needed to at least be clarified. Again though, everything has been done poorly.
There is a big difference in something being legally possible/doable, and making a morally poor choice and exploiting those potential loopholes. That is what people aren't sure about. Sure, it was within MD's right, seemingly, but does that mean it is 'right'?
MdotMaxson
309
Jun 26, 2019
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aikilinkSeeing a designer defend MD. I hope MD flucks him over good too. Count me out of whatever he designs next. Or maybe I’ll just pick it up from China when they rip him off on Ali expresss.
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The MK community has brought MD a very significant amount of money, without a doubt. The Input Club alone, with the Ergodox and other inventions on here really made this a successful endeavor for MD, and attacking them in this way is just plain pathetic.
Is it too late for me to cancel my Godspeed order? I'd imagine it's too late for cancelling Nautilus, but if MD doesn't speak up and do the right thing, I'll be doing what I can to cancel. I'm sure MD will get some nice, serious competition, as now GB vendors will be in demand. I feel bad for Mito, Oblotzky, OLKB and other awesome community members who will lose out on customers this way, but this is bad business, and I hope they are able to rally to help IC and prevent this from happening to them in the near future.
Assuming things are as they now appear to be: Shame on you, Massdrop. Shame on you.
Sincerely,
Someone who likely would have spent a lot more money here.