I would be very excited for this knife, however this would almost certainly get seized by Canadian Customs. Button on the handle plus centrifugal opening? Double illegal in the CBSA's views.
Canadians, be aware of the risks you're taking if you join this drop! My Falcon Wing was seized a month ago even though it is perfectly legal.
WolfOFJaxThe CBSA has actually specifically banned flippers :( but to make it worse, the revisions from earlier this year are vaguely worded so pretty much any opening means (finger hole, thumb stud, etc) can be considered "centrifugal opening".
From Customs Notice 18-01:
"...it includes knives that require some preliminary or simultaneous minimal manipulation of either a flipper or other non-edged parts of the blade."
BknguyenReally? Have they finally gotten around to it?
Or is it another one of their make-up rules that aren't in the Criminal Code of Canada?
Because as of August 1st (when I sent in my dispute of my seizure), the definition of a prohibited weapon on the Government of Canada Laws website stated:
prohibited weapon means
(a) a knife that has a blade that opens automatically by gravity or centrifugal force or by hand pressure applied to a button, spring or other device in or attached to the handle of the knife, or
(b) any weapon, other than a firearm, that is prescribed to be a prohibited weapon; (arme prohibée)
WolfOFJaxMakeup rule that is not reflective of actual laws within Canada. Just their regulations for what can come into the country.
Sounds like there have been more and more seizures from Massdrop too. If their hand is forced into removing refunds for seized stuff or just removing Canada from shipping lists then this is the end!
BknguyenThat's a little ridiculous to me, and likely many others feel the same as well.
They change their regulations at a moments notice so if a knife has, lets say a week's delay due to logistical problems, it can quickly go from legal to import to illegal with zero notice?
Thanks for your input by the way! Always appreciated when people respond!
WolfOFJaxYeah no worries. Last I checked, there was initial outrage and a petition with the backing of an MP that garnered >11000 signatures mine included. There was a thread here on Massdrop about it! That petition closed in June and there was supposed to be a reply within 45 days or something but I've heard nothing.
House of Knives was a big player leading the charge with support from other retailers and makers like NorthArm. I talked to someone from CuttingEdge, and they were waiting on a large shipment that was up in the air because of the regulation.
WolfOFJaxYeh, me too. I lost Tashi’s collab (low number too) and a Kizer. Oh and two custom flipper prototypes. They are off their freakin rockers this last half year. Before that...the only hassle was paying taxes and brokerage maybe one time in 4 or 5. “CBSA: Saving Canada one Puny Knife at a time!” Good work, boys!
PS. I’m still getting this drop, lol; are you, brother?
AxeguyUnfortunately, I don't think I will be. I like this knife a lot, but I would rather avoid any disputes with the CBSA and I've already passed my limit (and my partner's. Have to keep her happy too!) for knives this year.
DougFLA123Yeah with most shipping services they declare what's inside. The CBSA likes checking knives now so if the package declares a knife they're likely to open it.
Once open they can easily deem the knife illegal to import and will seize it
WolfOFJaxThat’s too bad. The laws, especially on automatic knives, are really silly. Here, in a lot of states, we can carry guns but we can not carry automatic knives. I personally don’t see a big difference between an automatic knife, a spring assisted knife or even a manual knife with a flipper tab. They all come out at about the same speed. Such antiquated laws.
DougFLA123It's all about keeping society safe one illegal knife at a time. The restrictions on knives are getting quite strict. In the city I live in, you rarely hear about stabbings anymore, mostly just gun violence.
WolfOFJaxSame here but only the import regulations have changed, not the carry laws. And knives are still readily available from any specialty or outdoors shop so it's hard to see the justification from the CBSA here.
WolfOFJaxWhat about screw drivers or ice picks, pencils or tactical pens all viable instruments to insert into flesh as easily as a knife? Are these items going to be banned next?
Gunnersmate2I know; right?! It’s not the weapon; it’s the training. My cell-phone—shod in 1/8”aluminum front and back—is a better weapon than any small knife, pen, or kubaton. I get in a bad tangle, it’s the cell-phone you’d have to watch out for. Anything can be a weapon. However, some things appear more weapon-y than others and so society—not science—is behind these kind of rules and regulations. Back to our fight: if the other guy has a knife, he’s going to jail while the police just give me a ride home (where I can clean the bits of scalp and gristle out of my cell-phone and case). A flawed model if there ever was one.
BknguyenYou’re right. Expensive and I feel important to my collection. I have ninety days to engage an approved courier to take them back to where I bought them...where they will likely repackage and try again, honestly. I gave myself a thirty day cooling off period before dealing with it. I think if they just siezed and incinerated knives, you’d have to build a wall along your northern border to keep all the Canadian knife guys from illegally immigrating! The setback weighs on you, though, and makes you think about only buying fixed blades (which aren’t nearly as problematic).
WolfOFJaxAh, yes. Must respect the spouse in all matters of money. The only good thing that ever came from being a widower is the huge knife budget (which may, unfortunately, keep me single).
AxeguyOh man the thought of incinerating a beautiful knife like a Prism or this one would be heartbreaking. Shame that our scene sucks compared our neighbours down south. Not so many retailers and big prices.
Anyway, keep up the good fight brother, hope it makes it through this time!
DougFLA123DougFLA123, do you have any spyderco knives with the frn handles without steel liners? I'm asking because I just got a dragonfly 2 and it is just the plastic handle with out liners. It feels soooo cheap. Really disappointing. Will not be purchasing any more with this handle
Gunnersmate2I do own Spyderco knives with FRN handle material. I even own the Dragonfly 2 with the Green FRN scales. A lot of people like FRN because they say its strong, more durable, more grippy, and lighter than G-10. I think FRN feels cheap(-ish) because it's so light. I do like my Dragonfly 2 a lot, especially if I choke up on it. I like that mine has dark green scales and also has ZDP-189 steel. My quest is to own every knife steel out there someday.
DougFLA123I've noticed our views and tastes in knives are similar but this is insane. The dragonfly 2 knife I just got is the ZDP189 British racing green. And I'm on the same quest of obtaining as many different blade steels as possible.
DougFLA123As cheap as the handle feels I will say this, it is close to, if not the sharpest knive out of the box I've ever seen. I'm sure part of it is the blade thickness, shape and grind but I'm impressed with the ZDP189 steel.
Gunnersmate2Yes, October. That’s what the guy who runs the GiantMouse Instagram and Facebook account said. Also, I was emailed by someone named Jim from GiantMouse who said October as well!
Gunnersmate2I have a couple of ESEE fixed blade knives that have micarta scales, but no folders with micarta scales. ESEE makes linen micarta scales and canvas micarta scales. In my opinion, the canvas micarta is much nicer than the linen micarta. The Linen micarta is kind of slick, the canvas micarta is more grippy. The GiantMouse scales are canvas micarta so they’re going to be great.
DougFLA123Yeah for sure! Mine too! Especially my Tom Brown Tracker! That thing's a beast. I love it.
Don't use it for much anymore since I switched to a Morakniv Garberg for my outdoors all-purpose (MUCH more practical and less hefty! Can't axe a tree down though...).
DougFLA123So I carried my dragonfly 2 yesterday and just realized it is still in the pocket of my pants. I know I'm going to end up forgetting it in my pocket and it will end up in the washing machine.
Gunnersmate2I have a Benchmade made with CPM-M4. I read that it takes a very sharp edge and holds it very well.
I don’t know if you’ve seen this knife steel guide, “Essential Guide to Knife Steel”, and I don’t know if it’s the gospel when it comes to ranking steels, but there’s some pretty interesting information contained in it. M4 steel is in the Premium Steel category.
Link to “Essential Guide to Knife Steel”:
http://knifeinformer.com/discovering-the-best-knife-steel/
DougFLA123I enjoy researching the different steel alloys, what's in them, how they are produced ect...ect... I find it fascinating and I think it's part of my sickness lol. I know I kinda bashed on my dragonfly 2 yesterday but considering the lifetime warranty it might be a great EDC knife. It's just going to take time for me to get used to the weight of it, lack of weight that is.
DougFLA123I think the best knife steel is largely in the eye of the beholder. Someone that's in the ocean every day is going to find the best steel to be way different then someone who is cutting cardboard all day. And someone who has a firm grasp on edge maintenance and the" stones "to do it will like different steels then someone who doesn't. Know what I mean?
DougFLA123The tempering process is a huge factor in edge performance also. I've been trying to get different manufacturers tempering specifications but is all proprietary
DougFLA123I think after the ace biblio next month I'm going to get a folder in a true super blue steel. I like the patina they take when heated. The blue haze is mesmerizing.
DougFLA123Funny, it didn’t start out that way. It started with a car backing up over my son’s phone. (It was laying there busted up and Siri was repeating “can I help...”. Kind of brought tears to the eyes.) In a quest to protect our phones, we basically ended up weaponizing the things...
Gunnersmate2That works better. If you buy a knife and have it shipped to Canada, they have to affix a form to the package detailing the contents and how much is spent. I have friends at a few places who will doctor the value on the forms, which helps the tax situation. And they have tried calling knives ‘tools’ or ‘camping tools’ but they aren’t falling for it as much as before... :( Of course, getting a friend to mail it across the border is helpful. They x-ray a suprising number of packages these days but it has to be better than filling out a form that basically says, “This is a cool knife this guy has been waiting for for months: time to bring on The Pain”...
AxeguyIf a friend sends you an unmarked package with a knife in it, and for some reason they x-ray it and find a knife, what happens? Does the sender get in trouble? Does the receiver get in trouble? Do they confiscate the knife and no one gets in trouble? Can you wrap the knife box in thin lead? I’m sure everything in the book has been tried.
Gunnersmate2I like using my dragonfly 2 for cutting open packages (especially if the package contains a new knife! 😀 ). It’s also good for breaking down, cutting up shipping boxes in order to recycle them.
There’s a lot that I don’t know about different steels, but I do like reading about the pros and cons of each.
DougFLA123As far as I know, there is no law broken, as the knives are not illegal to own—just to import. This was some kind of determination by a trade tribunal of some sort: no laws were changed. I think the only time there would be an issue in releasing your knife is if your knife or vendor were caught up in some larger investigation for some reason. So, no charges. Confiscation is the worst of it and the paperwork headache to get it released back to your friend.
Gunnersmate2Wow, that’s a tough topic. I/we (Canadians) feel badly for the polarization of your country. We never take our own politics too seriously: it’s a polite, collegial kind of thing—as if we all believe mostly the same things but for differences we realize are minor for the most part. Deep down, I’m sure you don’t believe your political opponent’s camp is “evil” or “degenerate” or “criminal” and yet these terms enter the rhetoric and drive this wave of neighbourhood-destroying emotion. In the end, contentious politicians’ terms expire or a tragedy brings you all together; right?! I do think, though, that there needs to be a plan to halt the erosion of the middle classes and the loss of high-paying jobs without alternatives. A renewed committment to innovate (an American strength) our way out of our climate predicament (with its ramifications on agriculture, resources, population displacement, etc.) would begin to overhaul infrastructure and industry with an eye to the future and would provide much-needed opportunities for the industrial heartland of the country. We could be a strong continent together (America, Canada, Mexico), if we tossed out the rhetoric and worked together. While valuable time is being wasted, don’t think the rest of the world is just waiting around. China’s smooth, continuous push through the sophisticated economies of the West has put them in a good position to overtake. Russia seems ready to take the Baltic states and other former ‘buffer states’... America, FOCUS dammit! Come back; we miss you! Sincerely yours, Canada Xoxo
PS. Let there be no borders for cool knives, even Russian ones!
DougFLA123There’s a certain pride we have in our own countries but we Canadians can be a little smug that way sometimes but people are people so the same problems rear their heads on both sides of the border. I went to school and worked in MI, FL, and IN and I made some of the tightest friendships in my life there. I worked in the inner city in Detroit in an HMO that had the contract to meet the needs of the population on Social Assistance there. I was pepper-sprayed and there was gunplay in my clinic once. I didn’t really feel afraid but the human misery and lack of opportunity was truly desperate. I was glad I could do something positive for the people. In turn, others help you and show you what to do or not do. Good, loyal people. Americans: pound for pound the kindest people I’d ever get the chance to know. As a group, though, your politics scare the crap out of me...and I don’t scare easy... (Must be the Infantry in me, lol!)
Gunnersmate2CPM-M4 on my Para 3 is the best blade I have ever used. It definitely made me like spyder co. before this para 3 I looked at spyderco people as fan bois but damn was I wrong, best knife out of all I own.
WolfOFJaxHey I just posted this above, but wanted to let you know here also: If we offer shipping to your country and any knife is seized by customs, just send us the notice and we'll issue a full refund.
JonasHeinemanYeah! MassDrop has been amazing on that front. I had a Falcon seized and I was quickly issued a full refund. Amazing service!
Thanks for replying!
WolfOFJaxWhere I live I have no concerns having anything seized just stuff stolen off my front porch. I read a bunch of complaints about massdrop's customer service but in my experience MD has always fixed any and every issue I've had. It takes time and patience is a virtue but i have no complaints. Keep up the outstanding work massdrop and I'll keep sending you my money.
DougFLA123You might think about your quest. I love the general concept, but there are some Gerbers, Smith and Wessons, Uniteds, and other mall ninja specials that I really wouldn't want to be part of my Every Knife in the World collection. Yea, I would NOT want a Kershaw in 3Cr13, either. (The added word NOT is the edit. I should have read this damn thing more closely before posting.)
Canadians, be aware of the risks you're taking if you join this drop! My Falcon Wing was seized a month ago even though it is perfectly legal.
From Customs Notice 18-01: "...it includes knives that require some preliminary or simultaneous minimal manipulation of either a flipper or other non-edged parts of the blade."
Because as of August 1st (when I sent in my dispute of my seizure), the definition of a prohibited weapon on the Government of Canada Laws website stated:
prohibited weapon means
Sounds like there have been more and more seizures from Massdrop too. If their hand is forced into removing refunds for seized stuff or just removing Canada from shipping lists then this is the end!
Thanks for your input by the way! Always appreciated when people respond!
House of Knives was a big player leading the charge with support from other retailers and makers like NorthArm. I talked to someone from CuttingEdge, and they were waiting on a large shipment that was up in the air because of the regulation.
PS. I’m still getting this drop, lol; are you, brother?
Once open they can easily deem the knife illegal to import and will seize it
(sarcasm intended)
Anyway, keep up the good fight brother, hope it makes it through this time!
There’s a lot that I don’t know about different steels, but I do like reading about the pros and cons of each.
PS. Let there be no borders for cool knives, even Russian ones!