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Massdrop x Focal Elex Headphones

Audiophile

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nishan99

Dec 27, 2018

There are mechanical clipping when there is medium bass amount on high volume ~75dB, and it's intentional. If you like to listen on high volumes and the music have good bass amount DON'T buy them.

(Edited)

Dec 27, 2018

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Fairingrey

102

Dec 28, 2018

nishan99Are you sure about that? 75db is nowhere near what would be considered 'loud'. I run my daily drivers at about that level (75-80db) and I would be extremely concerned if there were any level of clipping as that would suggest to me a manufacturing defect. Perhaps you should contact customer support regarding that. Out of curiosity, I've read into this around the internet with what I could find on google and I'm 100% sure you're referring to the problem addressed here: https://www.reddit.com/r/headphones/comments/9itn0h/elex_impressions_and_measurements/ I think it's a valid concern, but shouldn't bother most people unless you like to listen to your headphones at dangerously high levels, at which point you are more than likely to have hearing damage (95db+).

(Edited)

Dec 28, 2018

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rastus

1391

Dec 28, 2018

nishan99

FOCAL'S ANSWER

Dear Thomas,

The issue described is actually not a quality issue.

Indeed, we have made a clear design choice on Elear, Clear and Utopia. Our headphones have been designed to favor the respect of the dynamic contained within the audio signal versus dynamic compression that would offer a higher SPL capability but less respect of the original audio signal. To cut a long story short, the choice was audio quality oriented rather than SPL oriented. This allows our products to work with full performances until the mechanical clipping is activated. This means that you jump directly from a very low distortion to a sound which could be heard as rattling / cracking noise. On very special tracks with only very low frequencies at very high level, you can thus hear some noises - as you will do on classic loudspeakers.

If we change your pair of headphones, the new one will be designed similarly and it will also have a kind of cracking sound when you will be listening to music with high volume and a fair amount of bass.

The only solution we can recommend you is therefore to listen to your headphones at a lower volume.

Thank you for your understanding,

Best regards,

Marine, Community Manager Focal

https://www.focal.com/en/headphones-0/headphones/home/clear#documentation

Dec 28, 2018

Buckchester

Dec 28, 2018

nishan99I own a pair and have done testing with a MINIDSP EARS and HA-DSP. Mine will clip when the sub bass is boosted about 6db or more, and the volume exceeds 100db and the track being played has a high amount of sub bass. It definitely does not clip anywhere close to 75db. In fact, it won't clip at levels exceeding 100db for the vast majority of music. If you are clipping this headphone, you are probably at risk of damaging your hearing.

(Edited)

Dec 28, 2018

Uzuzu

1431

Dec 28, 2018

rastuswell that's just hilarious.....

Dec 28, 2018

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Uzuzu

1431

Dec 28, 2018

nishan99You realize 75 DB isn't loud right?

Dec 28, 2018

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nishan99

Dec 29, 2018

Buckchestergood for you, mine unfortunately do clip around 75 dB, that's for the left driver, the right driver will clip around 90dB (which is acceptable imo)

Dec 29, 2018

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nishan99

Dec 29, 2018

Uzuzuit's considered loud for a healthy ears, above 80 is very loud, around 110 is painfully loud. for my ears 85 dB is very loud and it's the maximum i can listen to, and unfortunately the Elex does not allow me to, that's why i have the Ananda to blast shit up. But to be fair the Elex do outperform the Ananda at medium and low volumes except vocals, they sound magic on the Ananda.

Dec 29, 2018

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Buckchester

Dec 29, 2018

nishan99I measured mine with a MINIDSP EARS, so I would consider this to be fairly accurate. And like I said, they don't clip anywhere close to 75db. Seems odd that yours would clip at 75db unless there is something defective with your pair, or you haven't measured them properly. Can you confirm how you measured them to determine they clip at 75db? Regarding your post below, I would also say that 75db is not very loud. I would say 85 dB is loud (you could listen for a long time at this level without damaging your hearing). 90-100db is very loud, above 100db is extremely loud and 110db would hurt your ears within a few seconds.

Dec 29, 2018

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nishan99

Dec 29, 2018

Buckchesteri have speakers and i measured how loud it is for me, as i said above in the 70's is loud and in the 80's is very loud (again for me). Then i can guess how loud the music on my headphones and the left driver clip when the music get between loud and very loud hence i said ~75dB and i use a compressed reference track that have even low, mids and highs with no apparent peaks. I also talked about this in depth in the head fi elear thread, and kinda confirmed that left driver is defective. Still the a lot of people will even bothered if the clipping happened around 80-90dB that's why i talked here warning them.

Dec 29, 2018

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Buckchester

Dec 29, 2018

nishan99So you don't actually know how loud they are playing when they clip, you are just guessing. You should have said this up front. I suspect it is louder than you think. And if you think your pair is defective, then you should have said that up front too. I am guessing that most people who are experiencing this mechanical clipping issue do not actually know how loud they are playing their headphones when experiencing this problem. After performing what I consider to be fairly accurate measurements with mine, I have to conclude that most people who are experiencing are playing their headphones way too loud.

Dec 29, 2018

nishan99

Dec 29, 2018

Buckchestermy guess in +-5db thats' for sure, the right driver is not defective from what i know and still clipping at high 80's dB is not acceptable for a lot of people. and it's not only me, google it and you will find tons of people complaining about tge same issue.

Dec 29, 2018

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Buckchester

Dec 29, 2018

nishan99How can you be so sure of when it clips without having measured it? Before I bought my minidsp ears I thought I was listening about 10db lower than I actually was. From my measurements, mine do not clip until after 100db, with a substantial bass boost with songs that have much higher than normal sub bass. This means that these headphones will almost never exhibit this behaviour. While it's possible my pair are not representative of others, unless you can provide me a link to others measuring theirs clipping at much lower volumes, I'm willing to bet most people experiencing this problem are listening at much louder volumes than they assume.

Dec 29, 2018

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nishan99

Dec 29, 2018

Buckchesteri am not crazy i know what loud is when i listened to my measured speakers, therefor i can guess with confident of -+5db how loud i am listening to my headphones, and i did experience this clipping even in normal listening scenario with a volume i enjoy for soundtracks or orchestras which is about 70-88dB. Just because i don't have a fancy tools to measure the headphones you can't just trash my findings. and you can google it and see by yourself the amount of people complaining about it, fuck i felt i am chatting with Focal's lawyer.

Dec 29, 2018

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Fairingrey

102

Dec 29, 2018

nishan99With all due respect, you're the one guessing here... everyone else reading this thread has all the more reason to doubt your findings. > google it and you will find tons of people complaining about tge same issue. Here are some of the relevant search results that came up after doing a search for "Focal Elex clipping" on DuckDuckGo:

> If you’re hitting the limit of the drivers at volume levels that are unsafe for even short term listening, you should be thanking Focal, not cursing them. > I tried to see if I could get my drivers to clip. Turns out I can! [...] Still, this volume is so freaking loud it kills my ears. I would never listen to songs that loud for more than a moment. Even at half that volume I wouldn't listen to. > FWIW, the clipping is an intentional design aspect, the issue seems to be the varying SPL levels at which different sets clip. Clip too low? Send em back until you get a pair that can handle 90dB. I think rastus's finding of Focal's response to this issue pretty much addresses everything you need to know about this issue, and the buck stops there. They make it clear that instead of opting for higher SPL capabilities that would kick in at extremely dangerous listening levels at the cost of sound quality, they chose to keep better sound quality instead. >the right driver is not defective from what i know and still clipping at high 80's dB is not acceptable for a lot of people. If it's as you say, then your pair sure sounds like it actually is defective. You really should contact Massdrop customer support.

Dec 29, 2018

Uzuzu

1431

Dec 30, 2018

nishan9975 db is the level of volume you can listen to 24/7 with 0 hearing loss. 80 db is excess of 4 hrs day = minor hearing loss, but 75 is the exact limit you can listen to with zero ear fatigue. I listen to music right around 73 always and have measure it hard.

Dec 30, 2018

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lugnut

103

Dec 31, 2018

nishan99I hope you never try to sell them as good quality used headphones ! Those need to go back to Focal. I am sorry but to have one driver clip at 75 db and the other at 90 db, that's just not right !

Dec 31, 2018

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Buckchester

Jan 1, 2019

lugnutI have re-tested my pair of Focal Elex. I used the song "Nightcall" by Kavinsky, which has a lot of bass in the 35hz-60hz region. I have the bass boosted by 12db from about 60hz on down and the mechanical clipping started at about 102db. If I take the EQ off and play at the same level, there is no clipping. But it's so loud at this volume that I can't listen for more than a few seconds.

Jan 1, 2019

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